andy_h Posted September 4, 2009 Report Share Posted September 4, 2009 Matchpoints! We are in 3rd seat, favourable and we hold: [hv=d=n&v=e&s=sqj8xhtdxxxcqt765]133|100|Scoring: MP[/hv] Auction goes pass-pass to you... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OleBerg Posted September 4, 2009 Report Share Posted September 4, 2009 2♠ or 3♣, depending on mood. Might be persuaded to pass. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billw55 Posted September 4, 2009 Report Share Posted September 4, 2009 ... you ask if I psych? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pooltuna Posted September 4, 2009 Report Share Posted September 4, 2009 Matchpoints! We are in 3rd seat, favourable and we hold: [hv=d=n&v=e&s=sqj8xhtdxxxcqt765]133|100|Scoring: MP[/hv] Auction goes pass-pass to you... Well the choices I see least likely to get you into trouble [i know, I know ...you are already in trouble] are pass, 1♠, 3♣ with 1♠ or pass getting my highest marks :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwnn Posted September 4, 2009 Report Share Posted September 4, 2009 I'm afraid I'd pass most of the time but sometimes I'd try 1♣, 1♠ or 3♣. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maggieb Posted September 4, 2009 Report Share Posted September 4, 2009 I would open 1N even in serious bridge, but all my friends already know that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fluffy Posted September 4, 2009 Report Share Posted September 4, 2009 My partner would need to be very weak for me to open this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jlall Posted September 4, 2009 Report Share Posted September 4, 2009 pass or 1S depending on opps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MFA Posted September 4, 2009 Report Share Posted September 4, 2009 I would open 1N even in serious bridge, but all my friends already know that.Hopefully your opponents do also?! (Or is your partner not a friend of yours ;).) Anyways, count me out of 3rd seat lunacy, just because we are green vs red. Not really bridge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike777 Posted September 4, 2009 Report Share Posted September 4, 2009 Matchpoints! We are in 3rd seat, favourable and we hold: [hv=d=n&v=e&s=sqj8xhtdxxxcqt765]133|100|Scoring: MP[/hv] Auction goes pass-pass to you... Pass almost always, 1s if late night. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gnasher Posted September 4, 2009 Report Share Posted September 4, 2009 3♣. I don't like 1♠, because partner is too likely to compete to 3♠, or double them in something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
francosca Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 I believe in light openers in third seat, but not in psykes .... unless you have an understanding... which is illegal... you could get burried if you find pard with a 10 count against a part score by opps Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trinidad Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 I predict that I will pass. IF I do something creative, I like it to accomplish something. I expect that the opponents can make 4♥. If I want to do something funny, while still aiming to get a good score, I would open 1♥, hoping that LHO doesn't have a bid. The best that can happen is that the opponents have about 15 and 11 points each without a decent bid in the first round, and the hearts splitting about 4-4-4. In that case, partner will raise my hearts and I will sit. Neither of the opponents will have the pattern to make a TO double and I go down a bunch in 2 or 3♥, undoubled, NV for the wonderful score of about -250 or -300. In my opinion, opening 1♠ is futile. LHO will double or overcall 2♥ and RHO will make sure they get to game. The best you can achieve is that they play you for all the outstanding cards when partner turns out to have most of them. But if partner has something, he will double their 4♥ and the situation is entirely clear. They will make 4♥ doubled and partner is not going to be amused. (And if partner has a reasonable amount of outstanding cards and doesn't double, you may get in trouble with the TD.) If you open 1♥ and get to play 2♥, partner will not be amused when you loose the first four tricks. But when he figures out that you loose 7 more and realizes that the opponents should have gotten 650 that feeling might change. But of course, opening 1♥ also has its drawbacks, which is why I predicted that I would pass. Rik Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jlall Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 3♣. I don't like 1♠, because partner is too likely to compete to 3♠, or double them in something. Partner is likely to double something because you opened in 3rd seat white/red? Guess this is a style thing, but I would not expect partner to double ever. Even if he has 10 points and they get to 3N, why would he double? Surely they have some reason for bidding 3N despite their lack of HCP. If they get to 4H and he has a couple of tricks, why should he double? Surely they have a reason for bidding 4H. I think it is a losing style for partner to double red/white opps because you opened in 3rd seat fav and he has some HCP. The opps know they lack HCP when they bid whatever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gnasher Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 I'm not suggesting that partner might double a freely bid game. I'm worried about him doubling them in a competitive auction. It's matchpoints and they're vulnerable. Suppose that they compete to 3♥ over our 2♠, or 4♥ over our 3♠. If partner thinks that opposite a normal opening bid we're making our partscore and the opponents have overcompeted, what is he supposed to do? If partner isn't ever allowed to double opposite a third-seat opener, you give your side a big disadvantage on all the hands where you actually do have an opening bid. The opponents will keep competing against your making partscores, knowing that it's going to be hard for you to take 200. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy_h Posted September 5, 2009 Author Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 Opps are pretty good and you do play drury (no doubt!). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 I would not expect partner to double ever. Not only this, but pard should not carelessly compete to the three level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gnasher Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 I would not expect partner to double ever. Not only this, but pard should not carelessly compete to the three level. That sounds like a winning matchpoint strategy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cascade Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 If you have a partnership agreement explicit or implicit to open this hand 1♠ then your methods are likely to be illegal in almost any jurisdiction. In the WBF they are HUM - openings a king or more below average. In the ACBL they are disallowed - "Opening one bids which by partnership agreement could show fewer than 8 HCP. (Not applicable to a psych.)" If you have an expectation that partner will not double nor compete to the three-level after these third in hand openings then that seems to be evidence of an agreement even if it is implicit. 1♠ should only be allowed if it is a genuine psyche, that is not part of an implicit agreement. If you open 1♠ every or most times you are dealt this or a similar hand at favourable and if partner expects it and if you expect partner to expect it then it would appear to cross the boundary from psychic bid into partnership agreement. And it would be an illegal partnership agreement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aguahombre Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 What Wayne said should be the way it is. I hope it is, and am too inept to research it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 I would not expect partner to double ever. Not only this, but pard should not carelessly compete to the three level. That sounds like a winning matchpoint strategy. http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/carelessly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jlall Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 I'm not suggesting that partner might double a freely bid game. I'm worried about him doubling them in a competitive auction. Ok fair enough, I expect them to freely bid game on every auction though lol. I have 5 points and pard passed. I mean assuming they're gonna bid game and I'm going to pass, what competitive auctions are we going to have where it's not clear that they are bidding to make. I guess if you pass lots of 11 counts maybe they won't always bid game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gnasher Posted September 6, 2009 Report Share Posted September 6, 2009 Ok fair enough, I expect them to freely bid game on every auction though lol. I have 5 points and pard passed. I mean assuming they're gonna bid game and I'm going to pass, what competitive auctions are we going to have where it's not clear that they are bidding to make. I guess if you pass lots of 11 counts maybe they won't always bid game. Sorry if I'm missing something obvious, but if they're always going to bid game, how do you gain by opening 1♠? If I opened 1♠, I'd be hoping for an auction like 1♠ (2♥) 2♠ (3♥), where both opponents have quite a wide range, so maybe they'll miss game when they're each at the top of their range. I agree that this isn't particularly likely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gnasher Posted September 6, 2009 Report Share Posted September 6, 2009 I would not expect partner to double ever. Not only this, but pard should not carelessly compete to the three level. That sounds like a winning matchpoint strategy. http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/carelessly I don't really understand your point. Are you saying that there are other actions that it is OK to take carelessly? For example, is it OK for responder to carelessly compete to the three level when he's not a passed hand? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jlall Posted September 6, 2009 Report Share Posted September 6, 2009 Sorry if I'm missing something obvious, but if they're always going to bid game, how do you gain by opening 1♠? I think it makes it much harder for them to bid slam, and maybe we get a good lead sometimes, and maybe partner bids 4S sometimes and pushes them to 5H or it's a good save (though sometimes this will be 800, I'll take my chances). Admittedly if we pass partner will overcall 1S on those hands then we can preempt, but it seems more effective if we bid first since RHO won't have had a chance to bid yet. Usually I would pass with this hand btw, 1S doesn't have huge gains but I don't view it as very risky either. I would be more likely to do it vs weak opps because I think the biggest downside of 1S is that the subsequent bidding should help them play the hand (because partners bidding will be honest), but usually against bad players it will make them misplay the hand anyways (HE OPENED! HE MUST HAVE THE HONORS!). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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