A third double?

[cherdanno]

[hv=d=n&v=n&s=skt965hakq9daq7c5]133|100|Scoring: IMP

P (1♣) X (1♠*)

P (2♣) X (3♣)

P (P) ??[/hv]

1♠ showed a club raise.

Do you agree with the second double? Do you double once more?

[Fluffy]

We have slight extras (we are suposed to have this strenght or shape, not both), but not enough for another action, pass

[Jlall]

i double

[gnasher]

I'd have overcalled a spade initially. Not having done so, I agree with the second double, and would make a third one now.

 

Takeout doubles have been so devalued that the second double is needed just to show something like K109x AKxx Axxx x. Therefore one more double is necessary to show this much strength.

[xcurt]

I would have bid spades on the second round. That way I could double again on the third round giving partner the option of pass 3♣x, 3♦, and 3♥. As it is I think I have to pass now since 3♠ is so committal (sick might be a better description on KT9xx) and If I double I think partner will imagine something more in the way of a really big balanced hand with ♣xx or so. I'm not looking forward to the decision he makes if I double 3♣. We're not likely to be killing 3♣ if he's passing by default, and they aren't vulnerable.

[Jlall]

I would have bid spades on the second round.  That way I could double again on the third round giving partner the option of pass 3♣x, 3♦, and 3♥.  As it is I think I have to pass now since 3♠ is so committal (sick might be a better description on KT9xx) and If I double I think partner will imagine something more in the way of a really big balanced hand with ♣xx or so.  I'm not looking forward to the decision he makes if I double 3♣.  We're not likely to be killing 3♣ if he's passing by default, and they aren't vulnerable.

Obviously if you were aware there would be a third round then this is a great plan, but with no assurance that the opps will help you out and bid 3C I think you are resulting to suggest 2S on the second round. Partner will not think twice before passing with x Jxxxx Jxx xxxx or similar.

[skjaeran]

I'd have started with a 1♠ overcall here.

 

Not having done so, I'm making a third double.

[helene_t]

Agree with the first two doubles. I don't consider this close at all.

 

I pass now, but a third double is close.

[Jlall]

If pard bids 3S over my double I will bid game.

[the hog]

I give up now.

[Cascade]

Probably double again ...

 

but ...

 

What sort of club raise?

[andy_h]

Yes I'd double again without any trepidation. We have extra values and we can still have game on. Nevertheless I'm not selling out to their 3♣ partscore.

[Phil]

I would probably double first. I would probably bid 2♠ the 2nd round (and double now).

 

I definitely double again.

[jdeegan]

:) Pass for me, but it is admittedly close. Partner figures to have a queen and a jack and three ♣. The way the tricks split could swing quite a bit depending on the location of the ♦ king and jack and the minor ♠ honors. What bothers me about a double is the existence of a class of hands where partner is 3-3-4-3 and responds with 3♦ - we buy the contract, but end up in the wrong suit. I don't see us missing a game since partner passed twice after I doubled for take out.

[dake50]

What did partner show by passing the 1S artificial raise? No S-fit? That X would suggest 3xS and not forward going, or is neg-X still on verses artificial bids?. He did not 2H to find that fit, nor 2C over 1S for 'pick a suit'. Did he hear me?! Doubled twice!! I think X 3rd is just obstinate. Unless T/O dbl on 11, repeat T/O double on 12, now I'm more than that(sarcasm).

[Hanoi5]

I double again and I agree with the bidding so far.

[ONEferBRID]

What did partner show by passing the 1S artificial raise? ...  is neg-X still on verses artificial bids?. 

side issue question:

p - (1C) - X - (1S! = Cl raise )

X = Responsive, showing both Majors?

or just showing Sp ?

[MFA]

I would probably double first. I would probably bid 2♠ the 2nd round (and double now).

 

I definitely double again.

I agree with Phil.

[nigel_k]

I would have bid spades on the second round. 

Obviously if you were aware there would be a third round then this is a great plan, but with no assurance that the opps will help you out and bid 3C I think you are resulting to suggest 2S on the second round. Partner will not think twice before passing with x Jxxxx Jxx xxxx or similar.

Obviously 2S on the second round doesn't work on the example hand above, but does on other hands such as Qxx Jxx Jxx xxxx. It's a question of choosing the percentage action and can't be resolved by quoting a single hand.

 

My view (admittedly just a gut feeling) I think it's best to bid spades on either the first or second round. Two (or three) takeout doubles without bidding a decent five card major leads to the wrong strain more often than a suit followed by double.

 

If the hand was a bit weaker, I would definitely overcall 1S. The actual hand is close between 1S and double.

[aguahombre]

like Nigel's reasoning, but don't agree that x, then 2S would prompt x JXXXX JXX XXX to pass without thought. A double, followed by a non-jump suit bid next time at the 2-level suggests doubt about trump along with a big hand --hearts should be reached.