Negative Free bids

[precpj]

I was partnering with an pickup assie playing against 2 LMs at Main Bridge CLub the bidding went

 

1C (RHO) 2D(Me) 2S(LHO) Pass 4C all passes when the dummy tabled down as

 

♠AT9762 [♥JT42 ♦73 ♣9 i: a 5 HCP count with a 6 spade suit

 

I politely ( i think) chatted " hmm would appreciate you alert your 2S... a negative free bid :P my favorite convention "

 

Both LMs ( ACBL speedball frenqenters obviously carrying POINTS on upperleft corner ) strongly disagreed and "teased" back

"let me know which alert you need " " we are playing with children.." " expert ? from which country " " I have toured all years around .." " I opened 1C looking to play in major what alert is for ..."

 

ME replied " calling people children is not in the spirit of our game especially from Life Masters ..." " I owe you benefit of doubt , I shall check with rulings@acbl.org and come back either with my apology or to share my findings "

 

per ACBL

"Bids which sound forcing, and are not; or bids which sound non-forcing, but are, always require an alert. Both instances are deemed to be highly unusual and unexpected.

 

In your example case the 2S call, if made by an unpassed hand, is clearly a forcing action. If you agreement is that 2S is not forcing, generally known as a negative free bid, an alert is due the opponents."

 

The posting is done to urge players here to alert your negative free bids to your partner AND to oppos. This game would be much harder if the bid below cud be as low as a few points to as high as 10+ or much stronger.

 

1H 1S 2C : 2C

1C 2D 2S : 2S

etc

 

Cud European friends share us with their negative free bid encounters ? I do know negative free bids are MUCH more popular outside America.

 

Precpj

[skjaeran]

Negative free bids are alertable in Norway.

They're not very common here.

[helene_t]

It is irrelevant whether they are alertable under ACBL rules. The main room is not under ACBL jurisdiction and besides the alert rules are different online than in real life.

 

Maybe your opps thought that their freebid style was within the range of what you expect from an unalerted freebid. In that case they would realize that they were wrong as soon as you say that you think it should be alerted, and the proper reaction from them would be "sorry, we will alert next time".

 

FWIW negative freebids are common and not alertable in the Netherlands. They are not common in UK, not sure if they are alertable, if I were playing them I would either put it on the front of the convention cards in the "attention" section, or alert them.

[kfay]

Odd to me that negative freebids wouldn't be alertable everywhere.

 

These guys sound like a couple of jerks, imo, who very likely aren't very good at bridge if they think they've traveled everywhere and observed that NFBs are expert standard.

[precpj]

I have asked credible sources from different countries:

 

other than Nederland and Poland i also found Palestine is on the same camp while Switzerland is on my the ? list to be confirmed the the Star I enquired.

 

Poland is a country where 2 level new suit after overcall by default is non forcing so NO alerting is required while 1 level and 3 level are forcing to our familiar understanding. The polish star who spoke to me DID also mention

1. when he plays out of his country he knows to alert

2. when 2 level response after the overcall is played as forcing then IT IS

ALERTABLE

 

I suspect there are more countries out there going with the same way with Poland; otherwise brdige will NOT be a game most of us can be comfortable when a 2 level response cud be ranged from as low a few HCP to a huge forcing hand

 

PJ

[1eyedjack]

For what it is worth, I understand that it is alertable in the UK in events subject to EBU jurisdiction.

 

The current EBU regulations are to be found here

http://www.ebu.co.uk/publications/Laws%20a...ange%20Book.pdf

Paragraph 5E1(b ) deals with the general case

Paragraph 5G2(c )(4) deals with the specific case.

 

I say "for what it is worth" because as has been mentioned earlier the event was under no jurisdiction other than BBO general regs, which are loosely defined. That said, if the bid is alertable in most other jurisdictions the only sensible interpretation of the BBO regs is that it should be alerted.

 

That said (again) I would if asked to rule look quite carefully at whether damage has ensued. The BBO regs are deliberately loosely defined, and negative free bids are not so rare that they should come as a complete surprise. I worry a bit about experienced players who, but for the failure to alert, may have reason to suspect that the bid may be a NFB but rather than enquire decide that they are onto a win-win by relying on that failure in the post mortem. I may be out of step with the rest of the world there.

[pirate22]

sympathy all round--i assume you alerted or stated 2 diamd's was weak.so 2 spades is in order(the 2sp bidder did not use a neg x) so it describes the hand ,if bidding progresses he may back in with a heart bid.

We have the WBF and each country affiliated.the rules adopted are not universal.

so at present you "pays your money and takes your choice" no one WBF included

will not make collated rules and regs,except very common infringements,but a lead out of turn/hesitation/revoke are agreed in all countries:)

I also have travelled the world and innocently infringed,by alerting a sys bid,and got into hot water, because of foreign local rules,and annualy a red/yellow book is produced,updating rules local---------everyone is trying to obtain a level ply field,if Bridge ever gets into the Olympics who will govern?

 

regards