worth to reverse?

[655321]

2♥

[fred]

hum.. that's interesting. Seems like the US is heading strongly into the "shape first" philosophy (most 2/1 versions are like this too). Wonder how you guys are going to sort out the level afterwards :lol:

If your post was in response to mine, then I am afraid you have it backwards.

 

Note my reference to "playing strength". That is a roughly the same as saying "trick-taking potential".

 

When you wonder how us guys are going to "sort out the level afterwards", it is actually a lot easier in the style I describe (because the style I describe focuses on trick-taking potential and knowing the trick-taking potential of your partner's hand is obviously of the utmost importance in terms of "sorting out the level").

 

Rebidding 2C with this hand makes it hard to "sort out the level" because partner will not normally expect this much playing strength for a 2C rebid. Since I think you are one of those people who sometimes rebids 2C with bad hands that contain an indifferent 5-card club suit, I really don't understand how you can advocate rebidding 2C with this hand as well.

 

And to describe this as "shape first" is wrong. It is "tricks first" - the hand in question has enough trick-taking potential to make a statement like "my hand is too strong offensively to rebid 2C". That is the primary message you should be trying to convey. The fact that you happen to hold 4 hearts means that you have a secondary message that needs to be delivered - that is why you rebid 2H instead of 3C.

 

If your post was in response to someone else's post then sorry about the confusion.

 

Fred Gitelman

Bridge Base Inc.

www.bridgebase.com

[helene_t]

If p has a weak hand with long spades we will end up in 3♠ after a reverse. If p can't have that because of his failure to make a WJS, it's close IMHO. Otherwise I don't think it's close.

[whereagles]

Fred: yeah, I was responding to your post.

 

After giving it a second thought, I think we're probably talking about the same thing. Around here the standard definition of 1x-1y-3x is a 1-suiter with something like ~15-17 hcp OR equivalent playing strength.

 

What I mean is that it seems to me the US style is heading more towards the 'equivalent playing strength' variant, leaving the hcp-based variant to rebid 3x only if the suit is very good. Else one bids either 2x (if min) or a new 3-card suit (if max). Agree?

 

Since I think you are one of those people who sometimes rebids 2C with bad hands that contain an indifferent 5-card club suit, I really don't understand how you can advocate rebidding 2C with this hand as well.

 

Who said I bid 2♣? :P I reverse (with 4 hearts) or rebid 3♣ (if no hearts).

[fred]

Fred: yeah, I was responding to your post.

 

After giving it a second thought, I think we're probably talking about the same thing. Around here the standard definition of 1x-1y-3x is a 1-suiter with something like ~15-17 hcp OR equivalent playing strength.

 

What I mean is that it seems to me the US style is heading more towards the 'equivalent playing strength' variant, leaving the hcp-based variant to rebid 3x only if the suit is very good. Else one bids either 2x (if min) or a new 3-card suit (if max). Agree?

 

Since I think you are one of those people who sometimes rebids 2C with bad hands that contain an indifferent 5-card club suit, I really don't understand how you can advocate rebidding 2C with this hand as well.

 

Who said I bid 2♣? :P I reverse (with 4 hearts) or rebid 3♣ (if no hearts).

OK thanks for clarifying. It sounds like we are more or less on the same page as far as these issues are concerned. I do try to avoid bidding 3-card suits (I am you are not thrilled with the concept either), but occasionally I will do so as a least of evils choice.

 

Fred Gitelman

Bridge Base Inc.

www.bridgebase.com

[zhams]

if partner rebid 2♠,can bid 3♣again.