MarkDean Posted March 27, 2009 Report Share Posted March 27, 2009 Here is an auction/hand from the loser's swiss. Playing precision with 2/1 GF. You deal, white/red, the opponents are silent, and the auction starts: 1♠ - 2♦2♥ - 3♦3♥ - 4♣ What did 4♣ mean? What is your call with AKJxxxK9xxxvoidJT? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdonn Posted March 27, 2009 Report Share Posted March 27, 2009 4♣ is artificial showing a strong heart raise. You need a way to show further interest without committing past 4♥. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereagles Posted March 27, 2009 Report Share Posted March 27, 2009 Dunno. Heart support and something in clubs, I guess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkDean Posted March 27, 2009 Author Report Share Posted March 27, 2009 Feel free to say what you think it should mean, but I also would like to know what you think it means when undiscussed opposite a solid player. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereagles Posted March 27, 2009 Report Share Posted March 27, 2009 Feel free to say what you think it should mean, but I also would like to know what you think it means when undiscussed opposite a solid player. If by this you mean pard has some 6-5 in the minors and hasn't been paying attention to the auction, then it's his problem :P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdonn Posted March 27, 2009 Report Share Posted March 27, 2009 Feel free to say what you think it should mean, but I also would like to know what you think it means when undiscussed opposite a solid player. If partner doesn't know it's a heart raise then he is not a solid player. And if he thinks it is gerber he doesn't have a solid skull holding his brain in place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricK Posted March 27, 2009 Report Share Posted March 27, 2009 I would guess that 4 ♣ is a cue bid for ♥. In response I bid 4♥ as the hand looks like a misfit to me, and partner doesn't have enough trumps to make slam on a cross-ruff a good possibility. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Echognome Posted March 27, 2009 Report Share Posted March 27, 2009 Seems very similar to an auction I had in Las Vegas, where I was 6=5=2=0 and the 4♣ call was doubled and I redoubled to show my first round control. Partner didn't enjoy playing in the 4-0. After that discussion, he was convinced when the next 10 expert players we asked all said it was an artificial raise in hearts. There was some debate as to whether it showed a control or was agnostic to one. (I believe the latter.) As for this hand, I really don't like my diamond void, so I'm going to bid 4♥ and see if partner can make another move. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rogerclee Posted March 27, 2009 Report Share Posted March 27, 2009 Agree with the others that this is a strong heart raise and says nothing about clubs. I think partner rates to have spade shortness, and obviously our hand is not so good opposite that, so committing to slam is wrong. Our hand certainly has extras, though, so I would bid 4♦ to give partner a chance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trinidad Posted March 27, 2009 Report Share Posted March 27, 2009 At first, your thinking should be: "This is a ♣cue in support of hearts." After that, you will realize that partner doesn't have any other cue available below 4♥: 3♠, 3NT, 4♦ and 4♥ are all needed as natural bids. This means that 4♣ cannot be linked to the club suit anymore. (What would you bid with a good hand, heart support, but no club control?). Therefore, it is a general bid showing a hand with heart support that is too strong to bid 4♥. Rik Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkDean Posted March 28, 2009 Author Report Share Posted March 28, 2009 Alright, I also thought it was a strong heart raise, even without discussion. That interpretation was not a great success. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdonn Posted March 28, 2009 Report Share Posted March 28, 2009 I forgot to say what I would do, which is bid 4♥. The void in diamonds, partner's likely spade shortage, and the awful hearts in what is definitely a 5-3 fit all point to signing off, not to mention the minimal high card strength. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lobowolf Posted March 28, 2009 Report Share Posted March 28, 2009 And if he thinks it is gerber he doesn't have a solid skull holding his brain in place. Fully consistent with my First Law: "The better the player, the less likely that any given 4♣ bid is Gerber." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hanp Posted March 28, 2009 Report Share Posted March 28, 2009 Undiscussed I would take it as Gerber, probably better to play it as a heart raise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
petergreat Posted March 28, 2009 Report Share Posted March 28, 2009 Impossible. Has to be control-showing. Gerber is only used after Jacoby transfers, natural NT openings and NT raises, and of course 2♣ - 2♦ - NT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JLOL Posted March 28, 2009 Report Share Posted March 28, 2009 Jdonn you overrate solid players. The average solid player would not know what 4C is here imo. Obviously this is more of a guessing game and you have more info than us on how old your partner is, where he's from, how convention oriented he is, etc. In general in these spots just try to safety play the auction to cater to all possibilities. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdonn Posted March 29, 2009 Report Share Posted March 29, 2009 Jdonn you overrate solid players. The average solid player would not know what 4C is here imo. Obviously this is more of a guessing game and you have more info than us on how old your partner is, where he's from, how convention oriented he is, etc. In general in these spots just try to safety play the auction to cater to all possibilities. I don't think we disagree about what people know, just about what solid means. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the hog Posted March 29, 2009 Report Share Posted March 29, 2009 Cue bid in support of H. I am bidding 4H as my D holding - n partner's suit - does not give me an adrenaline rush. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike777 Posted March 29, 2009 Report Share Posted March 29, 2009 Here is an auction/hand from the loser's swiss. Playing precision with 2/1 GF. You deal, white/red, the opponents are silent, and the auction starts: 1♠ - 2♦2♥ - 3♦3♥ - 4♣ What did 4♣ mean? What is your call with AKJxxxK9xxxvoidJT? without reading posters:4c=cue...agree hearts...now I rebid 4h. I will now read posters to see how wrong this is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neilkaz Posted March 29, 2009 Report Share Posted March 29, 2009 Agreed with this being a ♥ raise and I also bid 4♥ as I don't like my ♦ void and have weak trumps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matmat Posted March 29, 2009 Report Share Posted March 29, 2009 Impossible. Has to be control-showing. Gerber is only used after Jacoby transfers, natural NT openings and NT raises, and of course 2♣ - 2♦ - NT. there's also the 1NT-3NT4♣ gerber and the 1M - 4♣gerber and ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keylime Posted March 29, 2009 Report Share Posted March 29, 2009 Raise with club control; I could have bid 3♣ originally after the 2♥ rebid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skjaeran Posted March 29, 2009 Report Share Posted March 29, 2009 Strong heart raise, says nothing about clubs. There's no other cuebid available, so this is the only possible way to tell partner you've got heart support and a hand too strong for a simple raise and not suited for keycard asking at this point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skjaeran Posted March 29, 2009 Report Share Posted March 29, 2009 Undiscussed I would take it as Gerber, probably better to play it as a heart raise. Han, why don't you add a smiley to your jokes, to the benefit of those here that don't know you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matmat Posted March 29, 2009 Report Share Posted March 29, 2009 Undiscussed I would take it as Gerber, probably better to play it as a heart raise. Han, why don't you add a smiley to your jokes, to the benefit of those here that don't know you? that would make the comments less amusing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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