jtfanclub Posted February 9, 2009 Report Share Posted February 9, 2009 [hv=n=skt94hadak7652ca5&s=sa8hk874dqj984cq3]133|200|[/hv] North is dealer. We found (well, I made a slight adjustment to the hands, but on the actual one we found) 6NT played by South, made the 12th trick on a friendly spade lead, and a 13th on a simple squeeze. Partner was not happy that we did not find the much safer and higher scoring 7♦. Would you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TylerE Posted February 9, 2009 Report Share Posted February 9, 2009 1♣ (16+) - 2♣ (GF, 5+ ♦)2♦ (Trump ask) - 2♠ (5, 1 of AKQ)3♣ (Club ask) - 3♥ (3rd round)3♠ (Spade ask) - 4♥ (1st Round)5♥ (Heart ask) - 6♣ (2nd Round)7♦ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fluffy Posted February 9, 2009 Report Share Posted February 9, 2009 I end up in 6♦, maybe 6NT (if its MPs). after 1♦-1♥-2♠ I find no way to find spade doubleton from north, or 6th diamond from south. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fluffy Posted February 9, 2009 Report Share Posted February 9, 2009 1♣ (16+) - 2♣ (GF, 5+ ♦)2♦ (Trump ask) - 2♠ (5, 1 of AKQ)3♣ (Club ask) - 3♥ (3rd round)3♠ (Spade ask) - 4♥ (1st Round)5♥ (Heart ask) - 6♣ (2nd Round)7♦ don't you miss ♠Q? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jtfanclub Posted February 9, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 9, 2009 1♣ (16+) - 2♣ (GF, 5+ ♦)2♦ (Trump ask) - 2♠ (5, 1 of AKQ)3♣ (Club ask) - 3♥ (3rd round)3♠ (Spade ask) - 4♥ (1st Round)5♥ (Heart ask) - 6♣ (2nd Round)7♦ It's the doubleton spade that gives you your 13th trick- there's no place to park a spade loser. I don't see anything in your auction that would keep you out of grand if South has 3 or 4 spades. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwery_hi Posted February 9, 2009 Report Share Posted February 9, 2009 Perhaps: 1♦ - 2♦ (4+ diamonds, invm)4♦ (minorwood) - 4♥ (1430)4♠ (Queen ask) - 5♥ (Q + king of hearts)7♦ I don't know if the correct response to 1♦ is 2♦ or 1♥ with the south hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keylime Posted February 9, 2009 Report Share Posted February 9, 2009 In standard-ish 1♦ - 2♦* (inverted minor)2♠ - 3♥4♣ - 4♥5♥ - 5♠5NT* (GS try) - 6C* (need club help)7D (I can see 13 tricks here, pard has at least five diamonds and cooperatively went with a slam exploration) In Ultra: 1C* (strong) - 1S* (hearts, 4+, GF)1NT* (waiting) - 2C* (unknown canape)2D* (where?) - 2S* (diamonds)3D* (controls) - 3S* ( 3 controls)4D* (start Turbo) - 5C* (spade/heart is ok, one/three keycards)7D* (pard can count all controls, and Q♦ not needed) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdonn Posted February 9, 2009 Report Share Posted February 9, 2009 Lol what is this. The goal is to reach 7♦ so no one responds 1♥. Right.... What makes this hand tricky to me is that it's much easier if south bids keycard rather than north, but it's hard for south to find out about the club control low enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kfay Posted February 9, 2009 Report Share Posted February 9, 2009 I might reach this with one partner. But I'm being really presumptuous. 1♦*(4+ diamonds)-1♥1♠-3♦* (natural, forcing).4♦*(minorwood)-4♥*(one)4♠*(Queen?)-5♥(Q, + ♥K)5♠*(3rd round control of spades?)-7♦ 3♦ is a stretch. I'd expect 5-5 from it. :P In general I hate minorwood because every time someone bids it I want to go back and borrow my friend's Kantar book to see what all the followups are. Here I believe we're on pretty firm footing through 5♠, but I can't say for sure that is the meaning of 5♠. So I guess this proves I wouldn't bid this grand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fluffy Posted February 9, 2009 Report Share Posted February 9, 2009 I like your sequence kevin, but if you ever try this with me as partner you might end up in 4♦+3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keylime Posted February 9, 2009 Report Share Posted February 9, 2009 I don't respond 1♥, don't see why I need to if partner rebids 1NT, and I need to find a forcing set of bids. Yes, I know there's that NMF thing, but I rather keep things uncomplicated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
junyi_zhu Posted February 9, 2009 Report Share Posted February 9, 2009 [hv=n=skt94hadak7652ca5&s=sa8hk874dqj984cq3]133|200|[/hv] North is dealer. We found (well, I made a slight adjustment to the hands, but on the actual one we found) 6NT played by South, made the 12th trick on a friendly spade lead, and a 13th on a simple squeeze. Partner was not happy that we did not find the much safer and higher scoring 7♦. Would you? for those who don't play inverted minor raises with 4 card major(s),1D 1H2S 3D4C(cuebid, 4S+6D shape with C control, without C control, you can bid 4D) 4H(rkc)4S(4KC) 5H(we have all kc)5S(SK) 7D here, with 4-5 in S+D, usually opener shouldn't bypass 3NT. Also, if you play 2NT to show weaker hands（not leb), 3D should show extra, then 4C can be bid safely bid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajm218 Posted February 9, 2009 Report Share Posted February 9, 2009 1♦ 1♥1♠* 2♣** *100% forcing **4SGF3♦* 3♥** *showing strong 64 **cue3♠* 4♦ *cue4♥* 4NT *cue showing denied ♣ control as well5♣ 7♦ * knows is opposite at worst a 4162 or 4261 hand with K♠, A♥, AK♦ and A♣, ♠s can be ruffed in the dummy and K♥ pitch for rounded suit loser Can opener have one keycard... ;) probably not :P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenrexford Posted February 9, 2009 Report Share Posted February 9, 2009 North: Opens 1♦South: GF 2♣ artificial responseNorth: 2♥ (four spades)South: 3♦ (sets trumps) At this point, North can predict a probable inability to gain anything from cues. So, he just bids 4♥ 1430 RKCB. South shows one (4♠). 5♣ asks for the Queen (4NT would be a signoff), and South shows it plus the heart King (5♥). North now knows that he has no club loser and might have no problem in spades. So, he asks for the impossible spade King (5♠). South lacks this and lacks the club King, and he hates his hand, so he bids 6♦. North lacks sufficient info to pursue the grand without bypassing 6♦. However, he does have ability to get out at 6NT. So, he makes one last stab, 5♠. This is strange, as it essentially lets Responder know that the spade ask earlier was fake and that he is instead looking for tertiary spade values. With a doubleton, Responder might get this right. So, maybe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nxw0016 Posted February 9, 2009 Report Share Posted February 9, 2009 If South opens 1♦, and the scoring is IMP, it might be easier to reach 7♦ IMO. When north is the dealer.... it seems not so easy without a fancier system, especially in MP when everyone is NT crazy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike777 Posted February 9, 2009 Report Share Posted February 9, 2009 Dealer: ????? Vul: ???? Scoring: Unknown ♠ KT94 ♥ A ♦ AK7652 ♣ A5 ♠ A8 ♥ K874 ♦ QJ984 ♣ Q3 North is dealer. We found (well, I made a slight adjustment to the hands, but on the actual one we found) 6NT played by South, made the 12th trick on a friendly spade lead, and a 13th on a simple squeeze. Partner was not happy that we did not find the much safer and higher scoring 7♦. Would you? Tough North is worried that south has 3 spades and cannot pitch the third spade and South is worried that North has 3 clubs and cannot pitch the third club. For me to get there I just need to ignore that issue. 1D=1H2S=3D4H=4NT5C=5H5S=6D OR 7D?7D OR p? 4H=RKC FOR D4NT=1-45C=q ASK5H=qD AND KH5S=KS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codo Posted February 9, 2009 Report Share Posted February 9, 2009 1 ♦ 1 ♥ (Natural)1 ♠ 2 ♣ (nat, 4sf)3 ♦ 4 ♦ GF good hand with D, KC for Diamonds)4 ♠ 5 ♥ (real good hand with 4 aces) (Kings?)5 ♠ 5 NT (King of Spade? Something else?7♦ (a 6. Diamond) Dummy can claim after the lead: Spade A,K, two spade ruffs, Heart ace king, 6 Diamonds and ace of club. The key is the 4 Diamond bid. This is not just minorwood, but askes about extra strength too. And: It bypasses 4 club, so it denies a club control. Without a club control, pd will answer: Minimum, knowing that they have two club losers.Not perfect on any hand but works great here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike777 Posted February 10, 2009 Report Share Posted February 10, 2009 I suppose this is possible: 1D=1H1S=2C3D=4H4S=5H5S=7D 2C=4SF4H=RKC FOR D4NT=1-45H=PROMISE ALL KEY CARDS, SPECIFIC KING ASK5S=KS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Echognome Posted February 10, 2009 Report Share Posted February 10, 2009 I don't understand rebidding 3♦ after FSF on AKxxxx. The diamonds aren't good enough, IMO, for that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdonn Posted February 10, 2009 Report Share Posted February 10, 2009 I don't understand rebidding 3♦ after FSF on AKxxxx. The diamonds aren't good enough, IMO, for that. The diamonds are good enough. It's the 1♠ bid I don't understand, opener seems definitely good enough for 2♠. A 6-4 18 count with all aces and kings, and a T9 thrown in? Wtp? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Echognome Posted February 10, 2009 Report Share Posted February 10, 2009 I don't understand rebidding 3♦ after FSF on AKxxxx. The diamonds aren't good enough, IMO, for that. The diamonds are good enough. It's the 1♠ bid I don't understand, opener seems definitely good enough for 2♠. A 6-4 18 count with all aces and kings, and a T9 thrown in? Wtp? I guess it depends on whether fourth suit was forcing to game or not. If 2♣ forces to game, then why would we suggest diamonds so strongly, before we have heard of any support? If fourth suit is forcing 1 round, then we need to forcing to game now and 3♦ carries a lot less emphasis for strain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benlessard Posted February 10, 2009 Report Share Posted February 10, 2009 Playing scans after minorwood 4D-----4H (1)4S(Q♦ ?)------5C yes but no K of S.5H K of H?---------- 5Nt Yes but no K of clubs6C (extras ?)--------yes or 4D ------4H (14)4Nt (Ks ?)----5H (yes and the 2nd control in H but not in clubs)5S (Q of S ?)--------5NT (no)6C extras ?----------here you know that partner got either the K of clubs or thinks its possible you can avoid a club loser. Since he ask and you denied the Q of S the only remaining chance is that hes hoping that you have a doubleton H and a doubleton clubs. im not sure i would reach 7D OTB in the 2nd case. Case 1 is more likely to happen since its the big hand that has the club control. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
y66 Posted February 10, 2009 Report Share Posted February 10, 2009 I would not have found 7D. I play Minorwood but I didn't know about that 5S bid kfay used to ask for 3rd round spade control. Very nice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cascade Posted February 10, 2009 Report Share Posted February 10, 2009 North: Opens 1♦South: GF 2♣ artificial responseNorth: 2♥ (four spades)South: 3♦ (sets trumps) At this point, North can predict a probable inability to gain anything from cues. So, he just bids 4♥ 1430 RKCB. South shows one (4♠). 5♣ asks for the Queen (4NT would be a signoff), and South shows it plus the heart King (5♥). North now knows that he has no club loser and might have no problem in spades. So, he asks for the impossible spade King (5♠). South lacks this and lacks the club King, and he hates his hand, so he bids 6♦. North lacks sufficient info to pursue the grand without bypassing 6♦. However, he does have ability to get out at 6NT. So, he makes one last stab, 5♠. This is strange, as it essentially lets Responder know that the spade ask earlier was fake and that he is instead looking for tertiary spade values. With a doubleton, Responder might get this right. So, maybe. I like this approach. However I am not convinced South should hate the hand. South has two doubletons either of which could be useful. Over 5♠ I might bid 5NT saying I don't have the spade king but I do have extras (not the ♣K either). Opener will likely be able to infer the third round spade control. In fact we would use 5♠ here as a more generic - "Have you got anything else?". In context given opener has shown four spades with the ♠K south would be worth a jump to 7♦. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadaGrl Posted February 10, 2009 Report Share Posted February 10, 2009 Just for the record, the "partner" wasn't upset that 7 wasn't found.. He/she was upset that with the way the bidding went, there was zippo chance of finding 7 even if it was cold, and feels was lucky even to find 6 lolol :rolleyes: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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