What would these bids show?

[kenrexford]

1♣-1♠

2NT-3♦*

3NT-?

 

All is standard. Assume that 3♦ is NMF (the agreed approach in the problem sequence).

 

What would it now mean if Responder bids:

 

1. 4♦

2. 5♦

3. 6♦

[whereagles]

4♦ = 4+ cards, slam invite, opener now bids 4M fit+cue or 4NT misfit

5♦ = 6+ cards, mild slam invite (else straight 5♦ after 2NT)

6♦ = muddy. I'd say 55, pick a slam. (yeah I know opener denied spades) To play 6, bid 4♦ before bidding 6.

[Fluffy]

They are all natural, I agree with Nuno, except that I think 4♦ shows 5+ because partner already denied 4♦ when he opened 1♣.

[kenrexford]

A couple of follow-up questions:

 

1. Which sequence would be used to show 6♠/5♦?

2. Can Responder force the contract to either 6♦ or 6♠, Opener's choice, but not 6NT?

[ASkolnick]

1) If 3♠ Forcing, 3♠. If not 4D followed by 5D.

 

2) 1♣-1♠-2N-6♦

[Finch]

This is one of my pet peeves... it's a bit like asking what a 2S response to 1NT means, without specifying the rest of the system.

 

I can't answer the question, because I don't play NMF. But if I did play NMF, I would know

- what a 3S bid over 2NT meant

- what a 4D bid over 2NT meant (splinter for spades?)

- what a 5D bid over 2NT meant

- what a 3C bid over 2NT meant

- what 3D - 3NT - 4S meant

and

- What I open with 4-4 in the minors

- If I am allowed to be 4=5 in the minors for the 2NT rebid, and if so what I would bid over 3D with that shape

 

If the only agreement I have is that "3D is artificial and forcing" then I can make these sequences mean whatever I want them to mean.

 

Actually, it's not quite true that I can't answer the question because the middle part of it (3D....5D) I would expect to be 5=6 in the pointed suits with a weak hand.

 

(It's obviously going to come as a bit of a shock to you, but in one partnership I play 1C - 1S - 2NT - 3D as ...wait for it.... natural and forcing with diamonds!)

[ochinko]

Sorry, misread the bidding.

[Finch]

A couple of follow-up questions:

 

1. Which sequence would be used to show 6♠/5♦?

2. Can Responder force the contract to either 6♦ or 6♠, Opener's choice, but not 6NT?

Why would you want to show 5♦ if you also have 6♠? Just transfer to ♠, and RKCB if you have two singletons, or make an autosplinter/voidwood.

 

A six cards suit opposite a NT opening guarantees a fit, so you don't have to bid your 5 cards suit as well, especially if the longer suit is a major as in this case.

 

1NT - 4♥*

4♠ - 4NT*

 

or

 

1NT - 2♥*

2♠ - 4/5♣/♥*

The opening bid was not 1NT, the opening bid was 1C followed by a 2NT rebid.

 

As for why you might want to show your five card suit when you are 6-5, then (supposing you open 1C with 4-4 in the minors), where do you want to play with

 

Axxxxx

Kx

QJxxx

-

 

opposite

 

Kx

Axx

AKxx

Kxxx

 

?

[P_Marlowe]

#4D natural, at least 5-5

#5D does not really exist, you may construct it, as some

kind of voidwood, with spades as trumps, although

than the question arises, why did you not bid 3S

instead of 3D

#6D choice of slam

 

With kind regards

Marlowe

[P_Marlowe]

A couple of follow-up questions:

 

1. Which sequence would be used to show 6♠/5♦?

2. Can Responder force the contract to either 6♦ or 6♠, Opener's choice, but not 6NT?

#1 start with 4D.

#2 Will do the job, or 6D, 6NT does not exists.

6D offers the choice between 6D or 6S.

 

With kind regards

Marlowe

[Deevan]

I do play 3D as NMF but I agree with another comment that we need to elaborate our system a little more; especially:

 

What is 4D,5D,6D when bid directly over 2NT?

 

Coming back to your question. In the absence of knowing more about your bidding style or system details; I would like to sumit the following humble opinion:

 

-If we go via the 3D route, (a)we have some logical reason to ascertain partner's holdings in S and H suits (;) we are taking the slow route since we have a strong hand© Given the assumptions (a) and (:P; I would say that (i) 4D should show GF, 4+Diamonds, and give partner a chance to show doubleton Spades (ii) 5D is to play with the knowledge that partner has some Diamonds, should deny 6 spades (iii) 6D is also to play (iv) To tell you the truth I do not like the idea of 5D or 6D bids since they both sound unilateral. (v) To some extent the bidding should be influenced by the type of competition MP or IMPs.

 

Perhaps, some of the complications could be avoided by playing Wolff

[whereagles]

They are all natural, I agree with Nuno, except that I think 4♦ shows 5+ because partner already denied 4♦ when he opened 1♣.

There are some variants of natural bidding where 1♣ doesn't always deny 4 diamonds.

 

But yeah, under 'standard' circumstances, you're right. It shd be 5 cards.

[Deevan]

Clarification further to earlier comment:

 

Meant 4D asking for doubleton A,K or Q in Spades.

 

and,

 

5D, denying good 6 spades.