jtfanclub Posted November 10, 2008 Report Share Posted November 10, 2008 64KJT86543TKT Nobody vulnerable, Dealer to your right opens 3 clubs. Now what? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
655321 Posted November 10, 2008 Report Share Posted November 10, 2008 3♥ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoAnneM Posted November 10, 2008 Report Share Posted November 10, 2008 Pass. Don't pre-empt over a pre-empt. Who told me that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cascade Posted November 10, 2008 Report Share Posted November 10, 2008 Pass. Don't pre-empt over a pre-empt. Who told me that? I don't think this is a pre-empt with a hand worth 6-7 tricks opposite nothing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TylerE Posted November 10, 2008 Report Share Posted November 10, 2008 Put me with the 3♥ bidders. Will be impossible to catch up if we pass now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rogerclee Posted November 10, 2008 Report Share Posted November 10, 2008 This kind of hand has come up several times on the forums. As usual, 3♥ seems like the best call, since you have diamond shortness, and partner will routinely pass out 3♦ when you are cold for 4♥. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cascade Posted November 10, 2008 Report Share Posted November 10, 2008 This kind of hand has come up several times on the forums. As usual, 3♥ seems like the best call, since you have diamond shortness, and partner will routinely pass out 3♦ when you are cold for 4♥. The opening bid was 3♣ not 3♦ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdonn Posted November 10, 2008 Report Share Posted November 10, 2008 Pass. Don't pre-empt over a pre-empt. Who told me that? I don't mean to pick on you, but I have seen this several times before on the forums. The advice to not preempt over a preempt doesn't mean, as you seem to think, "don't bid over preempts with hands that you would have opened with a preempt." It means "don't JUMP over preempts with hands that you would have opened with a preempt." It's not saying "pass on this hand", that is nothing more than a matter of judgment. It's saying "don't jump to 4♥ on this hand", because that would show a very good hand. Sorry if that was all wordy, but it's something I have seen a few times. That being said, my judgment says 3♥ here and it's not that close. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pclayton Posted November 10, 2008 Report Share Posted November 10, 2008 3♥. This hand has nice playing strength. Shortness in the suit bid on our right is a bonus. I will plan to pull the 1st penalty double by pard, but not the 2nd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wclass___ Posted November 10, 2008 Report Share Posted November 10, 2008 3♥. This hand has nice playing strength. Shortness in the suit bid on our right is a bonus. >>>You have ♣ KT This is pass for me, and 3♥ is not close Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waubrey Posted November 10, 2008 Report Share Posted November 10, 2008 Well my partner and I play strong jump overcalls so I can't bid 4H. So I would bid 3H. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tcyk Posted November 10, 2008 Report Share Posted November 10, 2008 64KJT86543TKT Nobody vulnerable, Dealer to your right opens 3 clubs. Now what? If I bid 3H with that hand, the next stop will be slam. I'm not sure partner would be able to read 4H as a weak jump shift. Maybe 3H or 4H will be the right thing to do but my partner still has a chance to call. I think pass is right because 3H promises a hand worth about 16 points. You shouldn't fool mother nature nor your partner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rogerclee Posted November 10, 2008 Report Share Posted November 10, 2008 This kind of hand has come up several times on the forums. As usual, 3♥ seems like the best call, since you have diamond shortness, and partner will routinely pass out 3♦ when you are cold for 4♥. The opening bid was 3♣ not 3♦ Ok, then it is marginally less clear, but I would still do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codo Posted November 10, 2008 Report Share Posted November 10, 2008 Will I take more tricks with say:Axx,KJTxxx,Jx, KJ then with the actual hand? I doubt this, so my hand is worth a normal 3 Heart bid despite just 7 HCPS. But the seventh Heart is huge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P_Marlowe Posted November 10, 2008 Report Share Posted November 10, 2008 64KJT86543TKT Nobody vulnerable, Dealer to your right opens 3 clubs. Now what? If I bid 3H with that hand, the next stop will be slam. I'm not sure partner would be able to read 4H as a weak jump shift. Maybe 3H or 4H will be the right thing to do but my partner still has a chance to call. I think pass is right because 3H promises a hand worth about 16 points. You shouldn't fool mother nature nor your partner. I doubt that a 3H bid promises a hand worth 16HCP, I would say a min. opener with 5 hearts is enough. I would also bid 3H, the danger is of course, that partner can and will I expect some defence, which I dont have, thats why I will repeat the heart suit,if partner suggest a penalty. With kind regardsMarlowe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwnn Posted November 10, 2008 Report Share Posted November 10, 2008 no, don't pass with an 8 card suit, at least not now, not with this one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoAnneM Posted November 10, 2008 Report Share Posted November 10, 2008 jdonn, don't worry about picking on me, I have really tough skin, and thanks for the clarification. Besides you didn't tell me I was stupid, you just told me I was wrong. :( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
helene_t Posted November 10, 2008 Report Share Posted November 10, 2008 Well my partner and I play strong jump overcalls so I can't bid 4H. So I would bid 3H. Everyone plays strong jump overcalls over a preempt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sadie3 Posted November 10, 2008 Report Share Posted November 10, 2008 I'm going to bid 3H. If the opps want it, they are playing at the 4 level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pigpenz Posted November 10, 2008 Report Share Posted November 10, 2008 generally bidding 3♥ works but the hands where partner would have reopened with a double or 3NT we may end up too high, like 5 or 6♥. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skjaeran Posted November 10, 2008 Report Share Posted November 10, 2008 I'd overcall 3♥ here, and I don't think it's a close decision. Partner won't go crazy just because I overcalled. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ardf10987 Posted November 11, 2008 Report Share Posted November 11, 2008 May be I'm alone in this raisoning... but... when I bid, normally, it to make (or hoping to make) a game. If I bid 3♥, does really p will give me four with stiff Q♥ and AQ♠? Or with A♥ and another ace? Now suppose I bid 4♥ beeing wrong (as usual). What I will pay? - 300? If they have game, it' fine- 500? If they have game, it depends from scoring...- My p will skyrocket me in a slam? Well... I have a lot of tricks facing aces... and... I always find Q♥ :P Okok... honestly... at the end, I'll probably bid 3♥ me too... :unsure: But I'll admire all 4♥ bidders... :rolleyes: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy_h Posted November 11, 2008 Report Share Posted November 11, 2008 easy 3H. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barmar Posted November 11, 2008 Report Share Posted November 11, 2008 Pass. Don't pre-empt over a pre-empt. Who told me that? I don't mean to pick on you, but I have seen this several times before on the forums. The advice to not preempt over a preempt doesn't mean, as you seem to think, "don't bid over preempts with hands that you would have opened with a preempt." It means "don't JUMP over preempts with hands that you would have opened with a preempt." Hmm, I always thought it meant the former. When partner bids over a preempt, I expect them to have values, not just shape. If you bid with this hand as well as a full opener with a good suit, how is partner supposed to know what to do when he holds a good hand? I guess you hope he'll get the picture when you keep correcting anything he does (including doubling the opponents) back to your suit. Let's just hope this happens before you reach the stratosphere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jakob_r Posted November 12, 2008 Report Share Posted November 12, 2008 3♥ any day. "If you bid with this hand as well as a full opener with a good suit, how is partner supposed to know what to do when he holds a good hand?" pre-empts are intended to complicate your decision making. I would never blame partner for bidding 3♥ with that hand but I would be unhappy if he wussed out and passed.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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