y66 Posted October 31, 2008 Report Share Posted October 31, 2008 Matchpoints. Jxxx AKxx QTxx x Opps silent. 1D 1H2H 3D3H ? We open almost all 12 HCP hands and many 11 HCP hands with 5c suits. 3D was a non forcing game try. 3H showed 4 hearts and a minimum opener. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dicklont Posted October 31, 2008 Report Share Posted October 31, 2008 Pass. You asked, partner replied.It's a pity that your 3♦ bid doesn't show ♦ values.Then partner could make a more informed decision. I have no problem with bidding 4♥ right away.It's a bit of a gamble but it will make when partner has no wasted values in clubs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P_Marlowe Posted October 31, 2008 Report Share Posted October 31, 2008 Pass. I voted, before I did see the explanation of 3H, ... As it is, it is probably close, and if in doubt bid game, but partner having 4 hearts did not get exicted about my diamond values, so why should I, ... and my diamond values are the only reason, why I would bid game. With kind regardsMarlowe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr1303 Posted October 31, 2008 Report Share Posted October 31, 2008 If I was going to bid game, why did I bother making a game try? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pclayton Posted October 31, 2008 Report Share Posted October 31, 2008 If I was going to bid game, why did I bother making a game try? To see how quickly pard signs off? This feels like one for the committee. If you are judging this as a game try, you need to pass over a sign off. Are we playing the 2♠ or 2N gadget to ask about pard's trump length and strength? Does this partnership regularly raise on 3? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwnn Posted October 31, 2008 Report Share Posted October 31, 2008 +420 :) I'm happy with our -now confirmed- double fit and my concentration. this non opener is an OK game: xx Qxxx AJxx xxx You can add a few hcp (or diamonds!) here and there to make it a very very good game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kfay Posted October 31, 2008 Report Share Posted October 31, 2008 Matchppints? I'll pass! Will not be surprised by +170 at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
y66 Posted October 31, 2008 Author Report Share Posted October 31, 2008 If I was going to bid game, why did I bother making a game try? After pard bids 2H, I don't know if he is min or max or if he has 3 hearts or 4. When he bids 3H over 3D, he is showing a min (12-14 usually) and 4 hearts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ASkolnick Posted October 31, 2008 Report Share Posted October 31, 2008 Don't I have a 7 loser hand and a fit? I bid game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pclayton Posted October 31, 2008 Report Share Posted October 31, 2008 If I was going to bid game, why did I bother making a game try? After pard bids 2H, I don't know if he is min or max or if he has 3 hearts or 4. When he bids 3H over 3D, he is showing a min (12-14 usually) and 4 hearts. Very sorry - didn't see the 3♦ non-forcing thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cherdano Posted October 31, 2008 Report Share Posted October 31, 2008 I don't like the 3♦ game try. We really welcome any values except those in clubs, and 2♠ would have been a much better way to find out. If this means we have to play 3♥ in a 4-3 rather than 3♦, so be it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
y66 Posted October 31, 2008 Author Report Share Posted October 31, 2008 With 12-14 and 3 hearts, pard will pass 3D. Point taken re: 2S as an alternative to 3D. gwnn's argument for game seems fairly convincing. Don't understand ASkolnick's comment re: 7 loser hand (am not familiar with LTC). Will read up on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MFA Posted October 31, 2008 Report Share Posted October 31, 2008 I like 3♦ and it's not illogical to raise 3♥ to 4 when partner confirms the 4th trump.I have no strong feelings about the game/not game decision but would probably raise myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
han Posted October 31, 2008 Report Share Posted October 31, 2008 I also have n problem with 3D. I think game is slightly against the odds and I would not expect much of the field to bid it. At matchpoints I think this is therefore an easy pass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kgr Posted November 1, 2008 Report Share Posted November 1, 2008 Matchpoints. Jxxx AKxx QTxx x Opps silent. 1D 1H2H 3D3H ? We open almost all 12 HCP hands and many 11 HCP hands with 5c suits. 3D was a non forcing game try. 3H showed 4 hearts and a minimum opener. I would have bid 4♥ iso of 3♦. After having bid 3♦ I now pass 3♥. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the hog Posted November 1, 2008 Report Share Posted November 1, 2008 If I was going to bid game, why did I bother making a game try? Could not have said it better myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
655321 Posted November 1, 2008 Report Share Posted November 1, 2008 I like 3♦ and it's not illogical to raise 3♥ to 4 when partner confirms the 4th trump.I have no strong feelings about the game/not game decision but would probably raise myself.Agree with MFA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peachy Posted November 1, 2008 Report Share Posted November 1, 2008 This poll is not meaningful. When 3D is a non-forcing game try in your methods, then opener could a) pass 3D :P bid 3H c) bid 4H.After you have INVITED with 3D, you need to respect the signoff in partscore. If you don't respect it then your 3D was a misbid (I think it was, a misbid) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jikl Posted November 1, 2008 Report Share Posted November 1, 2008 I can't believe there is a (current) 48% vote for bidding 4♥ at the moment given the context of the question. You have made a game try asking partner whether we can make game. Partner has said no. You 48% are saying screw you I am bidding it anyway? I hope to not have you as partners. Whilst the system may be sub-optimal, at least respect it when answering. Sean Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwnn Posted November 1, 2008 Report Share Posted November 1, 2008 jjkl seriously have you read the opening post? Have you read the replies? We disrespectful people who you wouldn't like to play with have said we would bid game because we know now about the 4-4 fit in hearts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the hog Posted November 1, 2008 Report Share Posted November 1, 2008 jjkl seriously have you read the opening post? Have you read the replies? We disrespectful people who you wouldn't like to play with have said we would bid game because we know now about the 4-4 fit in hearts. I suspect you did not read the post. Did you not see that 3D was non forcing and that means opener could pass it even with 4H? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricK Posted November 1, 2008 Report Share Posted November 1, 2008 jjkl seriously have you read the opening post? Have you read the replies? We disrespectful people who you wouldn't like to play with have said we would bid game because we know now about the 4-4 fit in hearts. I suspect you did not read the post. Did you not see that 3D was non forcing and that means opener could pass it even with 4H? Does it necessarily mean that? The replies could be:Pass - 3 hearts and minimum3♥ - 4 hearts and minimumHigher bids non-minima of various sorts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwnn Posted November 1, 2008 Report Share Posted November 1, 2008 jjkl seriously have you read the opening post? Have you read the replies? We disrespectful people who you wouldn't like to play with have said we would bid game because we know now about the 4-4 fit in hearts. I suspect you did not read the post. Did you not see that 3D was non forcing and that means opener could pass it even with 4H? So what?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the hog Posted November 1, 2008 Report Share Posted November 1, 2008 jjkl seriously have you read the opening post? Have you read the replies? We disrespectful people who you wouldn't like to play with have said we would bid game because we know now about the 4-4 fit in hearts. I suspect you did not read the post. Did you not see that 3D was non forcing and that means opener could pass it even with 4H? So what?! So you clearly shouldn't bid 4, thats "so what". You are playing with yourself and not with a partner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
y66 Posted November 1, 2008 Author Report Share Posted November 1, 2008 This game try sequence is per Washington Standard. Opener can raise responder's one-level response with only three card support if opener has a ruffing value. Over opener's raise, responder has two questions: does opener have a minimum or a maximum; and does opener have three card support or four card support. 1D 1H 2H 2N and 1D 1H 2H 3D are non-forcing game tries. Opener is allowed to pass with a minimum with three hearts. Sorry for the confusion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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