Two parts

[han]

As for the comment that a 2♦ rebid is 'restful', as made by another poster, I note that no-one has attempted to rebut the basis of my argument... that the chances of missing a game (or a slam, for that matter) by making a non-jump rebid of a hand containing no primary fit for partner and 14 hcp and silent opps are low... [skip]

How exactly is one to rebute a comment such as "I think that the chances of missing game by rebidding 2D are low"? The only thing I can think of is that it seems to me that you are wrong, but that's just my judgement against yours which doesn't bode well for me. I could say that this hand has too much potential in spades, hearts and diamonds to rebid 2D. That with your seven top tricks you have too much playing strength and there are plenty 8- or 9-counts with which partner will pass and game is virtually laydown. And that I don't want to miss those games when vulnerable at IMPs. That the 17 points requirement is too rigid when you have a suit as strong as this, and that this hand is better than many 1453 16-counts.

 

But of course it is reasonably close, and if I was a sound opener (which I am not) and a very sound reverser (which I am also not) then I would rebid 2D.

[jdonn]

As for the comment that a 2♦ rebid is 'restful', as made by another poster, I note that no-one has attempted to rebut the basis of my argument...

It seemed to me that you knew you were being conservative and could miss games, so what would be the point of repeating that? I don't find your one random example too credible, it's so easy to make them in both directions. My partner has KQJxx x Tx xxxxx and is passing 2♦, now we have both done it :) I find restful a rather nice way to put it. You have 7 tricks, is it really so much to hope partner has two and they can't (or don't) run five? You even have the right Ax/shortness. Are you saying partner would pass your 3♠ bid with KQJxxx Qxx x Jxx but not with KQJxxx xx x xxxx? I suppose they could defend brilliantly to beat you unless diamonds are 3-3 but you know how it is...

[mikeh]

I don't find your one random example too credible, it's so easy to make them in both directions. My partner has KQJxx x Tx xxxxx and is passing 2♦, now we have both done it :)

 

At the risk of inviting a series of counter examples, would you really bid spades 3 times opposite a red 2-suiter with your example hand? Admittedly, you have constructed a tough hand but is the answer to bid make 3 consecutive forcing spade bids? Maybe it is :)

[jdonn]

I don't find your one random example too credible, it's so easy to make them in both directions. My partner has KQJxx x Tx xxxxx and is passing 2♦, now we have both done it :)

 

At the risk of inviting a series of counter examples, would you really bid spades 3 times opposite a red 2-suiter with your example hand? Admittedly, you have constructed a tough hand but is the answer to bid make 3 consecutive forcing spade bids? Maybe it is :)

1 - My main point was "look how easy it is to come up with hands that pass 2♦ but make game." The worse example I can come up with, the more easily that is proven. After all, if this hand should pass after 1♦ 1♠ 2♥ 2♠ 3♦, then imagine how many hands that shouldn't pass make game!

 

2 - If you were to get to game, it wouldn't be by responder bidding spades a third time. It would be by him raising to 4♦ and opener bid 4♠ or 5♦ (betcha didn't see that game makes too :))

 

I will only make one more counterexample, to show there are other games to consider. Kxxxx xxx x Axxx. Again, if you think this would pass the 3♦ bid then I don't know if it's true, but it would only further the point.

[the hog]

Personally I think that both 3D and 2H are overbids on this hand. I would ave bid 2D. As the auction has gone now, I would bid a simple 4S.

[Codo]

Personally I think that both 3D and 2H are overbids on this hand. I would ave bid 2D. As the auction has gone now, I would bid a simple 4S.

Ron your are getting really old.

 

So do I and follow the senior statesmen Mike and Ron.

[benlessard]

Im not part of the light reverse school, but this hand is strong enough to bid 2H. I like the J of diamond and the 2-1 in black. The risk and cost of missing a game by bidding 2D is higher than the cost of going down in 3D. I dont think however that 2D is a serious mistake and i wouldnt lose sleep if partner bid 2D.

 

Also with 1-2 in the black i would just bid 2D.

 

 

Of course any bid over 3D is GF. Over 3S i think 4C is the correct bid. Partner will know that since we dont have 3S we are 2461/ because with a 2452 and something in clubs ill bid 2Nt.