bidding comments please

[sceptic]

[hv=d=w&v=a&n=s3haq87dkqt983ck4&w=s764hkt3dj7cqjt85&e=skqt95h642d62c973&s=saj82hj95da54ca62]399|300|Scoring: IMP[/hv]

 

West North East South

 

Pass 1♦ Pass 1♠

Pass 2♦ Pass 3NT

Pass 6♦ Pass Pass

Pass

[rogerclee]

6♦ is a joke, pass is very obvious. Agree with all the other bids.

 

Bad bids pay off sometimes.

[effervesce]

South can't know that north has so much playing strength- his bidding seems normal.

 

North's first two bids are fine - can't reverse, 3♦ is an overbid while 2♦ I guess is a slight underbid, justified since partner bid 1♠ which doesn't look good for his hand.

 

6♦ is just a ridiculous bid-ridiculous bids pay off once in a while, but just because it works on one hand doesn't mean it's right.

 

Tough hand to bid to 6♦ legitimately though, unless north makes a 3♦ overbid.

[matmat]

I actually like a reverse on the N hand.

 

on the auction given, 6d is ridiculous. S could have given N another bid below 3n to clarify the hand and show the ♦Axx,

[Guest Jlall]

North should have bid 7D rather than 6 since it's cold. Conservative bidding does not pay off.

[mike777]

very hard hand to bid...

I play strong reverses but still I bid...

1d=1s

2h=sue me

[dbsboy]

I will definitely end in 3NT with this hand.

 

and Definitely North should pass 3NT.

 

 

But how to bid this slam? I think this is a better question.

 

I think South may bid something else instead of 3NT....he has a great hand with 3 Aces and 3 card Diamond support....if North has

 

♠KQX ♥X ♦KQXXXX ♣KXX

 

6D is a good slam, whilst 3N's may not make.

 

So if South can make a waiting bid then a forcing raise, they may find the slam?

[mike777]

I will definitely end in 3NT with this hand.

 

and Definitely North should pass 3NT.

 

 

But how to bid this slam? I think this is a better question.

 

I think South should bid something else instead of 3NT....he has a great hand with 3 Aces and 3 card Diamond support....if North has

 

♠KQX   ♥X   ♦KQXXXX    ♣KXX

 

6D is also a good slam.

 

So if South can make a waiting bid then a forcing raise, they may find the slam?

I guess i am missing your point...

 

 

If I mean if you reverse and I do............i see no choice the slam is easy.

 

2) with your example hand i may miss slam......not sure but yes I may.

 

bidding goes:

 

1d=1s

2d=3c(extras)

3s=4d(slam try)

?

[dbsboy]

Sorry if you cant get my point.

 

Try to make this clear.

 

1. I mean, in reality i cannot reach this slam, but I am suggesting a method which can help us to bid it.

 

2. I dont consider Reverse as I think this is not the choice of the vast majority

 

3. I illustrated another hand which must be less than a reverse hand but can still play slam opposite the AJXX XXX AXX AXX. That shows a number of hands which goes 1D-1S-2D plus the 3 Ace-hand can make slam. Which means that South should take more initiative?

 

Hope you understand better :P

[Guest Jlall]

On a more real note I think that reversing is horrible with the north hand, and bidding 3N with the south hand is horrible. So basically lol. How can 3N get support with the south hand, there is no heart stopper. Sure maybe south is not thinking SLAM but I would certainly be thinking, hey maybe we belong in 5D on this hand since I have no heart stopper, no diamond filler, prime cards, and only 1 stopper in clubs.

[dbsboy]

1 more point to add on.

 

Holding South's hand and learning that the auction is 1D-1S-2D

 

What I know is that, if North has a Singleton in ANY suit, the power of my hand rises a lot.

 

oh, Jlall explained it so well already.

[mike777]

Sorry if you cant get my point.

 

Try to make this clear.

 

1. I mean, in reality i cannot reach this slam, but I am suggesting a method which can help us to bid it.

 

2. I dont consider Reverse as I think this is not the choice of the vast majority

 

3. I illustrated another hand which must be less than a reverse hand but can still play slam opposite the AJXX XXX AXX AXX. That shows a number of hands which goes 1D-1S-2D plus the 3 Ace-hand can make slam. Which means that South should take more initiative?

 

Hope you understand better   :P

1) again assuming first OP.. then I reverse,,,yes even though i play strong reverses......over 1d=1s=?

2) my OP hand is really good.........

3) I can never catch up if over 1d rebid 2d.........

4) agree if you open on junk then 1minor rebid 3 minor is really wide ranging........too much so...so....i reduce it.....

[analysismi]

If you are going to think about slam as north, you should bid Gerber. Given North's hand, KQJ♠ and QJ♣ are all worthless points. If partner is missing one of the aces slam is almost certainly a no go. No need to rush to 6D here even if you are thinking about it.

[pclayton]

6♦ is funny. GIBs bid like this once in awhile LOL.

 

It is a good slam however. I haven't heard anyone make any suggestions on how to get there.

 

Gnome and I would start:

 

1♦* - 1♠

2♦ - 3♦**

3♥...

 

* - 5+ usually

** - GF

 

From here, South might just bid 4♣ which would be enough for North I think. If South goes low with 3N, North would pass.

[sceptic]

ok, have a field day here, BUT, my p usually has 13 hcp for this bid, given I am getting the lead into my hand, what 13 hcp hand does 6 diamonds not have a chance in, please bear in mind, I am confident pard has diamonds for the 3nt bid

[sceptic]

A spade A club lead kills me I know as does any two ace leads

[mikeh]

very hard hand to bid...

I play strong reverses but still  I bid...

1d=1s

2h=sue me

Anyone who says that they play 'strong reverses' and then says that they would reverse on this hand is mistaken about at least one of their statements.

 

How about this:

 

1♦  1♠

2♦  3♣

3♥  4♦

4♥  4♠

5♣  6♦

 

3♥ is a progressive move: with a soft hand, north would bid 3N.

 

So S can perhaps conclude that 5♦ is as safe as 3N and slam is not impossible, so why not make a try?

 

And if S makes a try, N's hand is wonderful in context.

 

I would need to be in my aggressive mode to bid this one.. I suspect that most of the time I'd be in 3N.

[fred]

ok, have a field day here, BUT, my p usually has 13 hcp for this bid, given I am getting the lead into my hand, what 13 hcp hand does 6 diamonds not have a chance in, please bear in mind, I am confident pard has  diamonds for the 3nt bid

It doesn't matter. To bid over 3NT is to violate a basic principle of bidding theory.

 

You have limited your hand and your partner has signed off. You should Pass without looking at your hand.

 

Maybe that is a bit strong since, from a practical standpoint, I could see bidding over 3NT with a completely bizarre hand (something like 8 weakish diamonds and a void in an unbid suit). But you won't go far wrong (and you will make your partners happy) if you never bid over 3NT in auctions like this one.

 

And you should not be confident that your partner has a diamond fit. How do you think he would bid with, say, 4324 plus 14 HCP and xx of diamonds?

 

Last paragraph edited. 4414 changed to 4324 as a result of misreading the original auction.

 

Fred Gitelman

Bridge Base Inc.

www.bridgebase.com

[rogerclee]

ok, have a field day here, BUT, my p usually has 13 hcp for this bid, given I am getting the lead into my hand, what 13 hcp hand does 6 diamonds not have a chance in, please bear in mind, I am confident pard has  diamonds for the 3nt bid

I wasn't having a field day until I read this. You post this ridiculous decision you made, and then have a bunch of experienced players tell you it was wrong, and you think you are right? "What 13-count does 6♦ not have a chance in?" LOL.

 

sceptic you are hopeless. I am tired of these pointless posts you make all the time.

 

(tilt is gone now)

[Finch]

ok, have a field day here, BUT, my p usually has 13 hcp for this bid, given I am getting the lead into my hand, what 13 hcp hand does 6 diamonds not have a chance in, please bear in mind, I am confident pard has diamonds for the 3nt bid

Why are you confident that partner has diamonds for the 3NT bid? That isn't normal methods. Apart from 4324 spades, wouldn't you bid 3NT on, say,

 

QJxxx

KJx

xx

AQx

 

Anyway, what 13 hcp hand does 6D not have a chance:

 

i) The ones missing two aces (that's easy) KQJx Kxx Jxx QJx etc

ii) The ones with an ace and a heart to lose

AQxx Jxx AJx QJx (yeah, 6D has some play, but that's a 15 count opposite)

[matmat]

also... we have a 14

p "usually" has 13

that's 27

we could easily be off three aces, could suffer an adverse ruff

 

do you intend to post every hand where you take a poorly grounded position and it happens to pay off?

[sceptic]

sceptic you are hopeless. I am tired of these pointless posts you make all the time.

 

Thanks for comment and don't read em if you don't like em

[P_Marlowe]

ok, have a field day here, BUT, my p usually has 13 hcp for this bid, given I am getting the lead into my hand, what 13 hcp hand does 6 diamonds not have a chance in, please bear in mind, I am confident pard has  diamonds for the 3nt bid

Hi,

 

ok, lets assume you are right.

That means you will have a 8 or 9 card fit in diamonds and 27HCP

in the combined hands.

 

But how do you know, that partner is looking at at least 2 Aces?

6D not only assumes, that your partner has 13HCP, it also assumes

he holds 2 of the 3 missing Aces.

As it is, partners 1S bid should be a warning signal, since it indicates,

that your partner will have lots of wasted spades values most of the time.

You may know due to system, that your partner wont have 5 spades

and hence no 4 hearts, since he did not use 3rd suit forcing, this reduces

the mentioned danger slightly, but not by much.

 

In other words, if you want to go looking for 6D, 4D has a lot more going

for it.

 

With kind regards

Marlowe

[Codo]

Hi Wayne,

 

I think your idea: What hands do not make 6 Diamond which makes 3 NT is not as bad as Roger wrote.

 

But as Frances pointed out, there are too many hands, where 6 Diamond fails, so your jump was not good. Whenever you think that your hand improved so much in the bidding that you should make another move here, try 4 Diamond.

 

But if you do so, accept that the best player at this Forum (Fred) and anybody else agrees that this is a very strong violation of partnership bidding.

 

Whenever you have ideas like this, be sure that you have a very understanding partner, because he shares the tops and zeros based on your wild strikes.

 

There are bidding sequences where it is correct to reaevaluate the hand during the bidding. This one is none of them.

[TimG]

After the first few posts in this thread, I thought for sure that OP was going to explain that this was his opponents' auction and he was wondering if they might have had a wire on the hand. In my opinion, just more evidence that strange bidding is seldom the result of illicit behavior.