Preemptive or a Game try?

[pclayton]

Here's a few auctions where a responder has the opportunity to make a 'good raise' via a transfer:

 

1♥ - (Double) - 2♦* - (pass)

?

 

(Assume 2♦ shows a constructive raise or better (8-ish+ and 3 pieces)

 

(1♣) - 1♥ - (pass / double) - 2♦*

(pass) - ?

 

(Assume 2♦ shows a limit raise or better and 3 pieces)

 

What is the best way to play a 3♥ call by opener / overcaller?

 

Do you differentiate between these auctions?

 

Thanks.

[rbforster]

I don't really see the need for a preemptive re-raise by the original heart bidder here.

 

In the overcalling case, 1♣ opener has failed to act already at his second call so we're not preempting him. If responder passed (rather than doubling) in that same auction, again I can't see who we're preempting since responder already denied a good hand. Maybe if responder doubled there'd be some merit to a blocking raise, but advancer has shown a strong (limit+) and unlimited hand so it's also possible we're preempting him in a way that makes it hard to judge if our distributional preempt fits with his limit raise in a way that makes game or not.

 

In the opening case, I think it's less clear since doubler could still have a very good hand and we might make it harder on him by preemptively raising. That said, it may also be dangerous to get too high with a strong hand sitting over opener. I'd probably use 3♥ as something constructive here, but could be convinced otherwise.

 

If you want generalities, I can see two possible rules -

 

1. 3♥ is always a game try of your favorite type

2. 3♥ is preemptive if 1♥ was doubled, and a game try otherwise

[Guest Jlall]

blocking

[mikeh]

blocking

ditto. If nothing else, it keeps the approach consistent across a wide range of sequences.

 

Alternatively: slow 3♥ is game try, focussing on trump, a quick one is blocking and a bid in tempo is a mixed raise.

[Guest Jlall]

This auction is funny to me because imo if the auction had gone 1H X 2H(constructive) p 3H everyone would think that is blocking, but since partner bid 2D showing the same thing and we jumped to 3H it somehow turns into a debate. It's just a psychological thing imo.

 

Also, I don't think 1C 1H p 2D p 3H is blocking, only if they doubled 1H (sorry for not specifying).

[Finch]

1♥ x 2♦ P

 

I play exactly the same methods as after 1H P 2H (constructive), which makes 3H blocking and other bids system on. But I don't play 2D as 8+, I play it as specifically a constructive raise (7-10 ish).

 

On the other auction I play 3H as constructive/game try. Why is the auction different? Partly because the 2D bidder has a much wider range of hands and is unlimited, also there is no sign that the opponents are going to do any more bidding.

[mikeh]

I agree with Frances and Justin re the meaning of the jump after the transfer advance, I was too busy trying to be funny to answer the original question carefully

[pclayton]

I've usually played it as blocking. On the actual hand I made an overcall on Q9xx AKQxx xxxx void. I thought it was close to a 4♥ call but I didn't like my spades with RHO passing over 2♦.

 

The opponents get to 5♣ and they wrap it unfortunately.

[kenrexford]

Blocking (since that's the term now). 100%. Anything else is silly.

[the hog]

I used to play sequences like 1-2-3 and the sequences mentioned by Phil after a X as "blocking". We had a long look at the results of this and decided it was silly to play this way. Now we play it as a gt.

[655321]

Blocking (except inv when they double the overcall)

 

Perhaps if all your bridge is played in weak club matchpoint fields this is unnecessary, but otherwise playing this as blocking when LHO is unlimited seems to me to be clearly best.

[kenrexford]

I used to play sequences like 1-2-3 and the sequences mentioned by Phil after a X as "blocking". We had a long look at the results of this and decided it was silly to play this way. Now we play it as a gt.

I had problems with "1-2-3 Stop" at one point too. I'm not saying that my problem translates into your problem, but my problem was that I bid the "3" part of this "convention" with absolutely no club what I was doing. If I had a sixth heart, damn if I did'nt always bid 1-2-3 Stop, or 1-2-3 Down One.

 

Now, however, I try to reserve a 1-2-3 blocking sequence for hands where there is merit to the approach. When I use better discretion as to when to bid at the three-level, the approach works better.

[mike777]

I play 1-2-3 blocking....if you prefer game try I think posters need to make a stronger point.

[han]

I play 1-2-3 blocking....if you prefer game try I think posters need to make a stronger point.

Thank you for your strong arguments. It will take quite some efforts to refute them.

[CSGibson]

Interesting sequence. I play Kokish game tries over a 1H-2H auction, and see no reason to give them up here. One of the game tries I use is a trump suit game try. Maybe it's not the most effective method, but it is consistent with my other auctions, so I would play it as a trump suit game try if my partner sprung it on me undiscussed.