rogerclee Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 IMPs, Red vs White, Second Seat ♠Kx ♥QJT7532 ♦x ♣Jxx (1♠) - ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jlall Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 no no no no no no no no no no no no no. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P_Marlowe Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 Given the vulnerability, we are red, they are green,I say No, change the vulnerability and I may changemy vote. With kind regardsMarlowe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy_h Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 Under these conditions, the suit quality isn't good enough for me. Put me down for a no. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gnasher Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 Yes. There's not much point in agreeing to play weak jump overcalls at adverse if you're not going to do it on this. I wouldn't do it at matchpoints though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
helene_t Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 Agree with Gnasher, -500 vs 420/450 is scary at matchpoints but at IMPs I would go for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
655321 Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 Yes, 3♥ for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jlall Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 shocking...gnasher and 655321 will preempt :) I do not understand the comment "if you won't do it on this hand you shouldn't play the convention" though.. it's not like this is a very remarkable hand. I don't think that we have to bid on the premise that a 3H r/w bid should be a frequent occurance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david_c Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 Take away the seventh heart and I might have to think a bit ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenrexford Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 I don't even have a preempt here. I mean, 3♥ would be intermediate for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickRW Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 Yes. There's not much point in agreeing to play weak jump overcalls at adverse if you're not going to do it on this. I wouldn't do it at matchpoints though. Well, I wouldn't pre-empt red/white. I understand your point - but then you can always agree to play something else for 3 level jumps red/white. Nick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
y66 Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 Why not 3H here? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kfay Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 Close for me. I like my ♠K and stiff diamond to keep potential damage down. I think it would vary on my mood. But yesterday I preempted at the 2-level with KJ9-seventh red so I'm just not feelin' it right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apollo81 Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 3♥, regardless of scoring. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSGibson Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 Yes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OleBerg Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 Under these conditions, the suit quality isn't good enough for me. Put me down for a no.As I see it, suit-quality is almost perfect. Good for taking tricks, highly unlikely to be worth a trick on defence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gnasher Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 shocking...gnasher and 655321 will preempt :lol: I do not understand the comment "if you won't do it on this hand you shouldn't play the convention" though.. it's not like this is a very remarkable hand. I don't think that we have to bid on the premise that a 3H r/w bid should be a frequent occurance. Whatever happened to the fearlessness of youth? When I was your age I'd have been in there with one fewer heart than this. Using 3♥ as a preempt has a cost: we're not using it for constructive purposes. If we don't use it enough to get value for money, we should switch to intermediate jump overcalls. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
helene_t Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 If we don't use it enough to get value for money, we should switch to intermediate jump overcalls. I don't get intermediate jump overcalls at the 3 level. A non-jump overcall at the 2-level already shows those values. I suppose strong jump overcalls would be handy when they came up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neilkaz Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 I would open this hand 3♥ at these colors, but to overcall 3♥ Red vs White I want a somewhat better suit, noting that my overcall may do absolutely nothing to keep the opps out of game since they've opened 1♠. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apollo81 Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 How many of the people who arent preempting would do it if a small heart were instead the ♥9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jlall Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 Using 3♥ as a preempt has a cost: we're not using it for constructive purposes. If we don't use it enough to get value for money, we should switch to intermediate jump overcalls. This logic does not follow, even if 1 is factual: 1) If we don't bid 3H on this hand, our frequency is too low and intermediate jump overcalls are better. 2) Therefore we should bid 3H with this hand. If the question was "should we change our methods" I like your reasoning, but since the question is "should we preempt with this hand" I don't like your reasoning. To me it is a deathwish to bid 3H with this hand at this vulnerability, and you do not gain often enough to compensate for it so passing is better than bidding 3H. Obviously you and others might disagree. I am happy to make a weak jump overcall with x AQJTxxx Jxxx x or whatever, and I am happy to play intermediate jump overcalls vulnerable, but with this hand playing weak jump overcalls I think it is way better to pass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OleBerg Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 How many of the people who arent preempting would do it if a small heart were instead the ♥9I voted to preempt, but I think it is close. If the hand contained the 9♥, I would find preempting clearcut. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rogerclee Posted June 20, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 [hv=d=e&v=n&n=s52hakdat974ckt52&w=st976h986dq6cq986&e=saqj83h4dkj852ca7&s=sk4hqjt7532d3cj43]399|300|Scoring: IMP[/hv]I passed, my LHO chose to pass (!!!), and we got to 4♥ after West chose not to sacrifice. The other table took the good save in 4♠, so we won some IMPs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenrexford Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 If we don't use it enough to get value for money, we should switch to intermediate jump overcalls. I don't get intermediate jump overcalls at the 3 level. A non-jump overcall at the 2-level already shows those values. I suppose strong jump overcalls would be handy when they came up. An intermediate jump overcall does not show the same values as a single overcall. Sure, the single overcall of 2♥ shows a better hand than a minimum 1♥ overcall of a minor opening. So, a 3♥ intermediate also shows a better hand than a 2♥ intermediate over a minor opening. The difference is about the same. Additionally, double...♥ shows a better hand over 1♠ than over 1minor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nige1 Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 IMPs, Red vs White, Second Seat ♠Kx ♥QJT7532 ♦x ♣Jxx(1♠) - ? IMO _P = 10, 3♥ = 93♥ is OK if opponents are better than you or your team is in desperate straits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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