han Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 I actually agree that it would be good if there is the possibily to turn back goal scoring situations by the use of video. If each coach/captain had the opportunity to ask for a video check say 2-3 times a game then that wouldn't break up the game unnecessarily. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aberlour10 Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 Do you remember that a very wrong descission by a referee cost as a world title back in 66? These things happen, sometimes to your benefit, sometimes you complain. That's right. Wembley goal? OK, but no one became more referee gifts in final matches of the World Cup's than Germany, do you remember these both penalties in 1974 and 1990, "free flights" produced by Hölzenbein and Völler? :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hotShot Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 The problem with the video is more difficult than one imagines. 1) Who is responsible that the equipment is working? What should happen, if the camera fails?2) What about clubs / countries that cannot afford the equipment? Are they not allowed to compeat any more?3) How can you prevent cheating? Cheating will get a new dimension, it is possible that a computer grid can manipulate the video signal in real time, so that the video referee, will get a false picture of the situation. The only methods would be that the referee team comes with their own equipment. Instead of 3 referees you will just need a few trucks full of technical equipment and 20-50 people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hotShot Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 Russia wins - Netherlands out. The teams that had their bad game in the group phase, kicked out 3 group winners (Portugal, Netherlands, Croatia) now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwnn Posted June 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 What an unbelievable match by Russia, 3 classes above their average game. I can't figure out why the Dutch played as bad as they played. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hotShot Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 Our experts discuss that all teams that used a "B-Team" in the 3 group game lost their quarterfinal game. So maybe they lost their "team adjustment".We will see if Spain can win their match. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
han Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 (^%&^%&%^%#@&$&% But Russia was better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codo Posted June 22, 2008 Report Share Posted June 22, 2008 I miss the oranjes, but they had been already lucky to reach the overtime.And I disagree that the Russians played 3 levels above their usual level. They did extrtemly well against Sweden, so it was no surprise that they are so good. It was a surprise that the Netherlands and Croatia had been so bad. It was no big surprise that Germany -Portugal was so close and I think Italies chances are not bad either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwnn Posted June 22, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 22, 2008 I'm afraid Italy will win tonight :blink: I didn't find Spain any better than 2006 or 2004... In 2002 Spain really had a great team - except they had 2 goals and a 1 on 1 chance disallowed vs Korea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianshark Posted June 25, 2008 Report Share Posted June 25, 2008 I am very much in favour of some use of video refereeing in football. My personal belief that the best case for using them is for judging off-sides because that is where the most (in terms of number and impact) mistakes are made refereeing a game. In terms of the logistics of videoing the incident, well one only needs to look at Rugby Union where decisions on contentious tries are, at the discresion of the match referee, sent to the television match official who has a million and one camera angles to consult to determine the outcome. The integration of this into the game has been seemless and widely regarded as a success. Can't they do something like that in American football when the coach challenges a refereeing decision? I'm sure other sports have other examples of how doable this move is. Logistics is not the problem, it's people being unwilling to change tradition that are holding it back. I for one would encourage what I believe would be a positive change. I watched the Italy-Spain match in the Old Town Square in Prague on the big screen. It was a great atmosphere. I was half-rooting for Italy but I suppose I'm happy Spain are through as they seem to be the only out-and-out attacking football team left, what with Portugal and Netherlands out. I also hope Turkey continues their great run. Their late comebacks have provided so much entertainment. With their 13 available men for tonight's game, I'm eager to see if the 3rd choice keeper comes on as a striker and scores the winner in injury time. ;) Of course I won't be watching the match because I play 5-a-side on wednesday evenings, grr... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cherdano Posted June 25, 2008 Report Share Posted June 25, 2008 Among the remaining teams, we have 1 vote for Russia, 4 for Spain, 10 for Germany, and 10 for someone else (i.e. Turkey)!!! I hope BBF will be wrong tonight ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david_c Posted June 25, 2008 Report Share Posted June 25, 2008 In terms of the logistics of videoing the incident, well one only needs to look at Rugby Union where decisions on contentious tries are, at the discresion of the match referee, sent to the television match official who has a million and one camera angles to consult to determine the outcome. The integration of this into the game has been seemless and widely regarded as a success. Can't they do something like that in American football when the coach challenges a refereeing decision? I'm sure other sports have other examples of how doable this move is. Logistics is not the problem, it's people being unwilling to change tradition that are holding it back. I for one would encourage what I believe would be a positive change.I don't think it's just logistics, it's about whether you stop the game or not. In football if the referee decides - the challenge was not a foul; or- the ball did not go out of play; or- the player was not off-side, then play continues, and indeed could continue for quite some time (and with more decisions for the ref to make) before the next stop in play. So if you can't make these decisions instantaneously you have a problem. In the sports which already have video refereeing, play has generally already stopped by the time the decision needs to be made. I am in favour of technology for making decisions, but only for decisions of fact which can be made instantaneously (by some sort of computer), not for judgement decisions. For example: - Did the ball cross the line?- Was the player standing in an off-side position when the ball was played?- Which team was the last to touch the ball before it went out of play? In principle these things could be computerised and a signal sent to the linesman when such an event occurred, who would then flag in the normal way. A spectator wouldn't notice any difference. But the first of these is by far the easiest to implement, since it only involves keeping track of one roughly spherical object, not 22 irregularly-shaped objects. So I'd like to see them implement technology for goal-line decisions first, and see how that goes. Automatic checking for off-sides would be of far greater benefit (they're so difficult for the linesman to get right), and I think it must be possible with sufficiently good technology, but it's so much harder to implement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aberlour10 Posted June 25, 2008 Report Share Posted June 25, 2008 Among the remaining teams, we have 1 vote for Russia, 4 for Spain, 10 for Germany, and 10 for someone else (i.e. Turkey)!!! I hope BBF will be wrong tonight :) tja Turkey has to play with Team B/C ( red, yellow cards, injuries) vs german tank :P will they have so many luck 3rd time? I cant belive it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hotShot Posted June 25, 2008 Report Share Posted June 25, 2008 Among the remaining teams, we have 1 vote for Russia, 4 for Spain, 10 for Germany, and 10 for someone else (i.e. Turkey)!!! I hope BBF will be wrong tonight :P Turkey is on the list with currently 1 vote. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bb79 Posted June 25, 2008 Report Share Posted June 25, 2008 we played our best game in the tourney, losing this way hurts so much. maybe this boils down to the saying "those who live by the sword, die by the sword"anyway we're proud of our team for their resilience and the excitement they brought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwnn Posted June 25, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 25, 2008 Frankly I was quite disappointed by the way Germany played tonight. Apparently some Germans complained about the pause too long (6 days since the Portugal match), sounds weird. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codo Posted June 26, 2008 Report Share Posted June 26, 2008 Yes to complain about a long pause sounds really weird. But all the teams which had a long pause (or even more the teams who create a long pause by playing with their B-team in the 3. game) played way worse then before. Fot the game: It had not been the better team which won this semifinal. Just the team with more luck when they shoot at the goal. The Turks had about 8 great opportunities, we had about 4. They played a great game, we fought. But so many lost duels, so many bad passes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwnn Posted June 26, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 26, 2008 Kind of reminded me of Germany in 2002 vs Korea. The Asians won two knock-out matches where they were inferior in terms of overall football level, then lost to Germany, despite seeming a little better. Now, Turkey eliminated both Czech Republic and Croatia, then lost to Germany. Of course, they had tremendous will power in all three matches, and deserve utmost respect for that. That said, I rooted for Germany in both the 2002 semifinal and this one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hotShot Posted June 26, 2008 Report Share Posted June 26, 2008 Frankly I was quite disappointed by the way Germany played tonight. Apparently some Germans complained about the pause too long (6 days since the Portugal match), sounds weird. Seems that the player feel that the confidence from the last victory is fading, while the pressure to win the next KO-match is growing. If the pause is to long, the confidence is gone and they start the game too nervous. During the KO-phase of championships good games have been rare and will be rare in future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P_Marlowe Posted June 26, 2008 Report Share Posted June 26, 2008 we played our best game in the tourney, losing this way hurts so much. maybe this boils down to the saying "those who live by the sword, die by the sword"anyway we're proud of our team for their resilience and the excitement they brought. There exists a truth, in the past quite often proved to be false: "Soccer is a simple game: 11 men chase the ball for 90 minutes and at the end the german win." By Gary Lineker Hopefully this truth is valid on Sunday. With kind regardsMarlowe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hotShot Posted June 26, 2008 Report Share Posted June 26, 2008 Marlow it's 22 not just 11.“Football is a simple game; 22 men chase a ball for 90 minutes and at the end, the Germans always win”.From Gary Lineker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mycroft Posted June 26, 2008 Report Share Posted June 26, 2008 Sounds like Goscinny's description of rugby (translated): "You play it with a bladder and XXX players divided into II teams of XV. It's really frightfully simple. You can do almost anything to carry the bladder over the other team's goal line. Anything's allowed except using weapons without previous agreement…" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwnn Posted June 26, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 26, 2008 amazing match by Spain! I'd be reluctant to say they are favorites in the final, though. All in all, the best two teams are in the final, imho. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codo Posted June 27, 2008 Report Share Posted June 27, 2008 Spain was so amazing because the Russians had been so horrible. What happened to them? I don't knowwhether the two best teams are in the finals. The spaish squad had been great. But our team?The Germans had the most effective team so far, but I think that Oranje(f.e.) will always beat them if they have a good day. Unluckily for our neightbours they happen to have more good days in the prem. or in friendly kicks, while we happen to have a team which is best when it has to be. So the Spains will have a hard time to show their best game and hopefully their second best is not good enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cherdano Posted June 27, 2008 Report Share Posted June 27, 2008 I had this conversation yesterday:"I lam happy that Spain is in the final, they would really deserve to win a big title once." "Right, too bad they are playing Germany in the final, then. Actually, Turkey really deserved to win the semifinal, too..." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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