Penalty doubles

[han]

Team game.

 

9865

K

1075

A10875

 

(p) - 1NT - (2S) - ??

 

You play penalty doubles, 1NT showed 15-17, 2S is natural. What's your call?

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

 

it is either pass or X, ... depending on mood I would

double, but it would be a terrible bid.

 

With kind regards

Marlowe

[TimG]

Pass. Game for our side is remote, especially now that the opponents have laid claim to the spade suit. Any plus score should be fine. The opponents likely have a better fit in hearts and a double might make it easier for them to get there.

[ArcLight]

I think the downside (doubling into game) is too great. Its less tahn 50%, but its not miniscule.

[jdonn]

You really have to know your opponent for problems like this, against a random one I guess I pass but there are ones where I would double all day.

 

The vul too.

[han]

Good point, everybody was vulnerable.

[pclayton]

I think doubling is very poor. RHO have should 6S and pard's Hx is poorly placed. One of our defensive assets (HK) is a precarious singleton. Its very easy to envision 8 tricks here.

 

If we beat it I will mentally thank RHO for taking us out of 1N with his source of tricks and probable entry.

[andy_h]

Pass. 9865 isn't that great and it's imps and we might even struggle to get our first 6 tricks.

[whereagles]

Obvious 2NT lebenshol, wtp??? Odds are huge that pard has 3 clubs.

[han]

This hand came up today at the United States Women trials. There was no double at either table. One of the commentators pointed out that that meant that both pairs must be playing negative doubles, but for hands like this you'd wish you were playing penalty doubles.

 

I didn't think it was so clear. It is possible that the commentator was influenced by the fact that 2S went down 1 and down 2 at the table.

[Guest Jlall]

I'd pass.

[MarkDean]

I would double. Maybe thiat is why all of my partners like to play negative doubles here...

Maybe I am influenced by the crap I overcall 2S on as well.

[ArtK78]

I hope the commentator was joking.

 

Doubling is OK at matchpoints but the risks at IMPs far outweigh the rewards.

 

If I had to guess at a result of the hand, I would guess down one at 2S. So doubling isn't going to show much of a profit. Only if you can beat it 2 or more is doubling profitable. But if it makes, the double would be a disaster.

[benlessard]

wtp pass for me.

[skjaeran]

Double would't enter my mind here, other calls might. Pass seems sensible though.

[Apollo81]

I'd pass.

[neilkaz]

I saw the hand as it was played. I wouldn't go head hunting at IMPs with 4 weak trumps. Needing a swing at MP I'll X and lead my stiff K of ♥.

 

2NT leb to 3♣ is possible as opener almost certainly has 3+♣, but I think passing it around to him is a little better.

[barryallen]

Obvious 2NT lebenshol, wtp??? Odds are huge that pard has 3 clubs.

To Leb or not to Leb? You know you have no chance of bumping them into 3♠ so that extra is out. It also looks favourable that you will end up with a positive score either in 2♠ by them or 3♣ by yourself? But I would not take the risk and just pass. To double here just is asking to get kicked around the table by your team mates in the post match.

[mikeh]

I don't know, and don't want to know, who the commentator was. But, some commentators are relatively weak and prone to 'analyzing' based on seeing all the hands. Other commentators feel pressure to say something, and so type a comment without thinking it through and others exhibit elements of both weaknesses .. btw, I include myself in that category lest anyone think that I am being overly harsh on whoever made the comment in this case.

 

As it is, double seems to me to be borderline insane.

[Guest Jlall]

All,

 

You have SEVEN points, and FOUR spades. Even if partner has minimum holdings in both, combined you have TWENTY TWO points and SIX spades, and could have more! Not just that, but you have an ace and a king. These are quicktricks, and undervalued by the point system! So it is basically impossible for them to make with so few HCP AND spades AND quick tricks, making this a clear double.

[han]

Hehe.

[655321]

I didn't get it (Being Foo perhaps?)

 

Never mind, if it was someone more current, I probably don't need to know - enough flame wars for the time being :)

[Guest Jlall]

I didn't get it (Being Foo perhaps?)

 

Never mind, if it was someone more current, I probably don't need to know - enough flame wars for the time being :)

Was just a joke, not on anyone in particular

[barryallen]

I don't know, and don't want to know, who the commentator was. But, some commentators are relatively weak and prone to 'analyzing' based on seeing all the hands. Other commentators feel pressure to say something, and so type a comment without thinking it through and others exhibit elements of both weaknesses .. btw, I include myself in that category lest anyone think that I am being overly harsh on whoever made the comment in this case.

 

As it is, double seems to me to be borderline insane.

So very true. Competent players turn into blithering idiots when put into the commentary position.

[pclayton]

I don't know, and don't want to know, who the commentator was. But, some commentators are relatively weak and prone to 'analyzing' based on seeing all the hands. Other commentators feel pressure to say something, and so type a comment without thinking it through and others exhibit elements of both weaknesses .. btw, I include myself in that category lest anyone think that I am being overly harsh on whoever made the comment in this case.

 

As it is, double seems to me to be borderline insane.

So very true. Competent players turn into blithering idiots when put into the commentary position.

Commentating can be like playing. If you are fresh, then you can spot things fairly easy, and stay objective about what only the player can see from his POV.

 

If you are tired, its really easy to make errors, since you miss key points, or don't see a bid, or whatever. For me, I also get a little tense when I'm commentating with someone, really, really good, but theres only one or two players I get uncomfortable with.