Is this worth a bid

[ArcLight]

IMSP - opponents Vulnerable

 

RHO opens 1♣ (SAYC, not a big club system like Precision)

 

You hold

♠ AK52

♥ J43

♦ KJ9

♣ T65

 

Do you Pass or make a takeout double. ( I leave out overcalling 1♠ because the suit isn't good enough)

[whereagles]

borderline. I'll probably dbl most of the time, though. (because hcps all outside clubs)

[Guest Jlall]

I like to X with this type of hand but passing is certainly fine too. Most people would pass.

[inquiry]

DBL and then you are done, unless partner makes a forcing bid.

[655321]

Double. I used to pass with these 4333s, but these days doubling seems to be more common.

[pclayton]

I'm going to pass this. This hand is still a little lite for me to double with a 4333, and I would not like to put this down as a dummy in 2♥. If I double, I telegraph the hand for declarer.

 

If I pass, what auction do the doublers foresee developing that creates problems for us?

[andy_h]

X - I like it

[ArtK78]

Pass. If you are going to double on a 4333 hand, you should have extra values. A flat 13 count just doesn't cut it for me.

[jdonn]

I double 1♣ because it's low, but I would not double a major on a similar hand.

[kenrexford]

X.

[effervesce]

Pass. I like my low-level Xes to have the right shape if without extras. Besides, it's not MPs.

[the hog]

1S. Since when is a suit headed by the AK not good enough to bid at the one level. Besides, 1S takes away a lot of room, which the double certainly does not.

[MarkDean]

I guess I am out of touch. To me, this is a clear pass.

[jtfanclub]

I guess I am out of touch.  To me, this is a clear pass.

I think a vast majority of people who play on Earth would pass this, or bid 1♠ if they've agreed to that kind of overcall. For people who play on the Internets, I think there's a lot more doubling (and also at the highest levels, it seems).

 

I Can't stand it when my partners X with this, since we tend to end up in a losing Moysian fit at the 4 level when 3NT was makable. But that's a matter of partnership agreement- if you're expecting this, then it isn't hard to handle.

[Guest Jlall]

I guess I am out of touch.  To me, this is a clear pass.

I think a vast majority of people who play on Earth would pass this, or bid 1♠ if they've agreed to that kind of overcall. For people who play on the Internets, I think there's a lot more doubling (and also at the highest levels, it seems).

 

I Can't stand it when my partners X with this, since we tend to end up in a losing Moysian fit at the 4 level when 3NT was makable. But that's a matter of partnership agreement- if you're expecting this, then it isn't hard to handle.

Yeah there are not enough bids between 1C and 4H to work out whether or not you have a 4-3 fit or not when partner has GF values, it sucks

[jtfanclub]

I Can't stand it when my partners X with this, since we tend to end up in a losing Moysian fit at the 4 level when 3NT was makable. But that's a matter of partnership agreement- if you're expecting this, then it isn't hard to handle.

Yeah there are not enough bids between 1C and 4H to work out whether or not you have a 4-3 fit or not when partner has GF values, it sucks

So you never play 4♥ in a 4-3 fit? Good to know.

 

Sample responder's hand.

QJx

AKxx

A7

9xxx

 

So, where are you going to play this?

[bill1157]

1S. Since when is a suit headed by the AK not good enough to bid at the one level. Besides, 1S takes away a lot of room, which the double certainly does not.

Agree totally, plus good lead director

 

Bill

[jillybean]

I like 1♠ too.

[neilkaz]

Out of 100 total points

 

1♠ 55... I'd like a 3rd honor, but it seems that most of the time PD isn't giving up a trick when he leads ♠, which is not to be said for his other possible leads.

1♠ takes up lots of bidding room and can make a mess out of the opp's auction if they don't combine to a clear GF and have to start with a 2 Red call, or a negX and then guess.

 

Pass 30 ... I don't care for minimal off shape takeout doubles in general and when I do X, PD's ♥ are most likely better than his ♠ if both 4/4 and we may (unless he can make a respX) find it hard to get to the best major. When I put down this hand as a dummy for ♥, PD will often gag. Passing now doesn't prevent the us from declaring later and, in case PD is broke, doesn't tell the opps where most of the missing HCP are.

 

X 15 ... I'd rate it lower but I all 12 of my HCP are in the other suits and it doesn't risk missleading PD about my ♠ length and means that we aren't guessing to balance later.

 

Just my opinion that 1♠ over 1♣ can cramp the opp's auction and is worth the gamble for me White vs Red. Reverse the vul and I am less happy with 1♠ and make my suit ♥ and I won't likely bid 1♥ which gives most opps plenty of leeway to instantly describe their ♠ length (negX=4 ..1♠=5+) and isn't as preemptive. So to overcall 1♥ on 4 cards I'd want an even better suit, or a bit more playing strength than I have.

[skjaeran]

I double here. Occasionally I might overcall 1♠.