DrTodd13 Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 [hv=d=n&v=n&s=sktxhjt9xxxdcxxxx]133|100|Scoring: MP[/hv] North opens a 15+, artificial 1♣. You bid 1♦, 0-8.West doubles.North bids 1N.East bids 2♠. Your call? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
han Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 What was double? What's our agreement for 1NT, do we just ignore the double? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halo Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 3♥ Edit: it's a poll so I guess I should add some reasoning. I have a fair hand with a six card suit: partner appears to have diamonds, so I restrain my enthusiam and bid three rather than four. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrTodd13 Posted May 9, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 What was double? What's our agreement for 1NT, do we just ignore the double? Double was showing ♦. 1N is some non-minimum NT shape with a ♦ stop. We have XX available to show 19+. So, I expected 1N is 17 or 18. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtK78 Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 Another relevant question - what is a 2♥ response to 1♣? In many strong club systems, it shows a long suit with less than a positive response. I would bid 3♥ now without any problem. I have excellent playing strength for a hand that has announced 0-8 HCP. I would bid 4♥ if I had a 7th heart, but that begs the question of what would a 2♥ or 3♥ bid have meant on the first round of bidding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrTodd13 Posted May 9, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 3♥ Edit: it's a poll so I guess I should add some reasoning. I have a fair hand with a six card suit: partner appears to have diamonds, so I restrain my enthusiam and bid three rather than four. We were playing leb so 3♥ is game forcing but presumably not sure ♥ is the trump suit or looking for something more than game but that is hard to imagine given lack of opener's XX and responder 0-8. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrTodd13 Posted May 9, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 Another relevant question - what is a 2♥ response to 1♣? In many strong club systems, it shows a long suit with less than a positive response. I would bid 3♥ now without any problem. I have excellent playing strength for a hand that has announced 0-8 HCP. I would bid 4♥ if I had a 7th heart, but that begs the question of what would a 2♥ or 3♥ bid have meant on the first round of bidding. Immediate 2♥ would have been 9+ with 4♠ and 5+♦. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtK78 Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 Why would you play Lebensohl in this context? You have already limited your hand to 0-8 HCP. Presumably, you wouldn't take a call with 0-3 HCP in this situation, so you must be showing the upper end of your range by bidding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awm Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 4♥ seems normal. Might be better to transfer at the four-level if such is available. We have a lot of shape and a well-placed spade king, and partner has shown more than a strong notrump. Obviously one can construct partner hands where game is poor, but assuming LHO has a lot of the diamond cards and RHO a lot of the spade cards I think we are odds on to make. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halo Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 3♥ Edit: it's a poll so I guess I should add some reasoning. I have a fair hand with a six card suit: partner appears to have diamonds, so I restrain my enthusiam and bid three rather than four. We were playing leb so 3♥ is game forcing but presumably not sure ♥ is the trump suit or looking for something more than game but that is hard to imagine given lack of opener's XX and responder 0-8. OK So move my vote to 4H (I should have read the options more closely.) I sympathise with a poster who is bombarded with questions. Gt on with it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrTodd13 Posted May 9, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 Why would you play Lebensohl in this context? You have already limited your hand to 0-8 HCP. Presumably, you wouldn't take a call with 0-3 HCP in this situation, so you must be showing the upper end of your range by bidding. Why lose the ability to differentiate 4-6 versus 7-8? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cherdano Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 4♥ seems normal. Might be better to transfer at the four-level if such is available. I disagree, it is often helpful to keep the hand with shape and a void hidden. How should RHO know to shift to a club rather than a diamond at trick 2? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtK78 Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 Why would you play Lebensohl in this context? You have already limited your hand to 0-8 HCP. Presumably, you wouldn't take a call with 0-3 HCP in this situation, so you must be showing the upper end of your range by bidding. Why lose the ability to differentiate 4-6 versus 7-8? If you believe that the difference between 4-6 and 7-8 HCP on this auction is critical, then by all means use Lebehsohl. I don't believe it is that critical, and Lebensohl auctions are always tricky. In the auction presented, there is a good chance that LHO will bid over 2NT if it is used in this sequence, and South will never have an opportunity to show his hand. I have never seen Lebensohl used in a situation where responder had already limited his hand so severly as in this situation. I would have to experiment with the method to see if it is optimal. I suspect not, but I have no experience with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jtfanclub Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 I have no call for an invitational hand with hearts?! Don't you think that's going to be pretty common with this auction? What would 3♠ show here? 2NT followed by 3♠? I'm not familiar enough with Lebensohl, I guess. If there's a call that shows 4-6 with hearts, I'll take it. Otherwise, I'll just bid 4♥. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awm Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 4♥ seems normal. Might be better to transfer at the four-level if such is available. I disagree, it is often helpful to keep the hand with shape and a void hidden. How should RHO know to shift to a club rather than a diamond at trick 2? What I really don't want is LHO pushing a club through. If I bid 4♥ myself, then LHO is on opening lead (chance to push a club through, although he will often lead spades or from a diamond sequence). If I transfer to hearts, then LHO can't really even get the lead, and there is also the possibility of RHO leading a diamond at trick one into a possible tenace in partner's hand. Anyways, playing 4♥ from my side RHO can see the dummy's minor suit holdings at trick two. Chances are dummy holds a tenace in at least one suit, and RHO's best defense is to switch to the other suit (regardless of which minor it is; forcing my hand could easily be the best defense). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
han Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 I sympathise with a poster who is bombarded with questions. Gt on with it! LOL Don't you think it is relevant to know what the double means? Most people I know play that this double shows the majors which would be very relevant and would explain the extremely weird timing of the 2S bid. Who passes over a strong 2C bid and then bids 2S over a diamond showing double? I don't know the system now but I would normally bid 3D showing hearts and pass 3H. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrTodd13 Posted May 9, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 Yes, the 2♠ has pretty strange timing. I'm wondering if she thought the X was for majors. If she thought that, she should have alerted. I suspect she might have thought that because she had less length that you might expect in ♠. Out of curiosity, if it goes 1N (15-17) and you hold this hand, do you think out of 7 tables you aren't going to get anybody in 4♥? How many tables would you think are going to transfer to 2 and not even invite? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
han Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 Out of curiosity, if it goes 1N (15-17) and you hold this hand, do you think out of 7 tables you aren't going to get anybody in 4♥? How many tables would you think are going to transfer to 2 and not even invite? In an average club roughly 0 pairs are going to be in game, but partner might have 18, and I don't pay too much attention to what the field does anyway. Still, I would not force to game with this hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdonn Posted May 10, 2008 Report Share Posted May 10, 2008 Out of curiosity, if it goes 1N (15-17) and you hold this hand, do you think out of 7 tables you aren't going to get anybody in 4♥? How many tables would you think are going to transfer to 2 and not even invite? I would invite, but at most clubs I've been to I would expect signing off to be a huge majority action. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apollo81 Posted May 12, 2008 Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 4♥ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skjaeran Posted May 12, 2008 Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 4♥ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheoKole Posted May 14, 2008 Report Share Posted May 14, 2008 If you play Texas transfers, you can bid 4 ♦ as a transfer to hearts over an overcall up until and including an overcall of 3 ♣. If you want to bid more solidly just bid 3 ♥ on the playing strength of your hand.I would bid 4 ♦ Texas because of the lead factor is probably worth 1 trick. Cheers, Theo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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