han Posted June 11, 2008 Report Share Posted June 11, 2008 Let's make a bet Justin, I'll bet on Italy you on Ireland. What odds would you like? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skjaeran Posted June 11, 2008 Report Share Posted June 11, 2008 I think Netherlands might be hard to beat this time. Our team and Italy's are weaker than normal. Our team should be among the top six, and qualify for next years Bermuda Bowl, and might fight for a medal if all three pairs do well. The new format is to Italy's disadvantage I think. They won't benefit from clobbering all the weaker teams, since there's no carry over to the second round. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vincenzo Posted June 11, 2008 Report Share Posted June 11, 2008 It could be interesting to make a poll in Italy to check how many bridge players agree with MTL decision .... Agree with Roland .... this is politic .... not bridge ..... I can't tell more for the moment ..... I think that many persons in Italy hope that italian team will not overcome the round robin !! Vincenzo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jlall Posted June 11, 2008 Report Share Posted June 11, 2008 Let's make a bet Justin, I'll bet on Italy you on Ireland. What odds would you like? Since it is such a long event, I would need 8:1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pclayton Posted June 11, 2008 Report Share Posted June 11, 2008 Let's make a bet Justin, I'll bet on Italy you on Ireland. What odds would you like? Since it is such a long event, I would need 8:1 Ireland was one of my dark horse picks in the BB. I'm not making that mistake again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walddk Posted June 11, 2008 Report Share Posted June 11, 2008 I agree with Harald; Netherlands will be serious contenders for gold. The Dutch have three very strong pairs, Italy has 2½. With all due respect, Angelini is not in the same league as the other five. I have not forgotten that Italy won the championships, comprehensively even, with the same team on home soil in 2002, but things have changed: - 1. The format is different.- 2. The Italians are not as strong as they used to be.- 3. The other teams have improved considerably. I predict that Italy will not risk Sementa-Angelini much when we reach stage two, and that will put a lot of pressure on the other two pairs. 17 matches of 20 boards after they have completed 19 matches (also 20 boards). Not a single day off. That will take its toll even for the 'invincible' Italians. No matter which two pairs Netherlands select for a match, they field their strongest team if you see what I mean. That is not the case with Italy. As for Ireland, I don't think they are in for anything big. I won't go into detail, but you need to have some inside information to make this prediction. Roland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jlall Posted June 11, 2008 Report Share Posted June 11, 2008 I will bet on italy over the netherlands at 1:1 also. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aberlour10 Posted June 12, 2008 Report Share Posted June 12, 2008 In my opinion this modified format of the event would be more interesting & exciting if the teams which qualify to the second Round Robin could take over VP's from the matches vs teams which qualified to the second stage too. ( similar to the handball and icehockey events ) Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulg Posted June 12, 2008 Report Share Posted June 12, 2008 Naturally this would make sense if you were not to play those teams again, but as it is a full round robin in the second round it would mean that you play 40 boards against some teams and 20 against the others. It would also favour those teams qualifying from the weaker group, which is the Italy (and Scotland) group this time. Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twcho Posted June 12, 2008 Report Share Posted June 12, 2008 Root for Netherlands this time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
helene_t Posted June 12, 2008 Report Share Posted June 12, 2008 In my opinion this modified format of the event would be more interesting & exciting if the teams which qualify to the second Round Robin could take over VP's from the matches vs teams which qualified to the second stage too. ( similar to the handball and icehockey events ) Robert I get your point. If I recall correctly, the icehockey/handball format means that you won't have to play those teams in 2nd round which you already met in 1st round). In bridge terms that would mean that if e.g. 1st-round matches are 20 boards while 2nd round matches are 40 boards, you only play the remaining 20 boards against those you already met in 1st round. It has a minor drawback, namely that if say Ireland and Spain are competing for a place in the 2nd round, Italy started by losing to Ireland, and now Italy meets Spain in the last match of the 1st round, Italy may need to avoid slaughtering Spain too heavily because that would bring Ireland to the second round which would not be in Italy's interest. Nevertheless I think it would probably be better than the chosen format. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walddk Posted June 12, 2008 Report Share Posted June 12, 2008 Paul is right; a carryover makes no sense when you have to play against the same 8 teams again. 40 boards against 8 teams, only 20 against the other 9. Where do you find the logic? Much better to let them start from scratch. Roland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cherdano Posted June 12, 2008 Report Share Posted June 12, 2008 Surprising lineups? Yeah I was surprised Loew brought Odonkor - oh wait, that was the other thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joker_gib Posted June 13, 2008 Report Share Posted June 13, 2008 Surprising lineups? Yeah I was surprised Loew brought Odonkor - oh wait, that was the other thread. Yes and they are betting between Italy and Netherlands and the result is already known : 3-0 ! :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwnn Posted June 13, 2008 Report Share Posted June 13, 2008 Surprising lineups? Yeah I was surprised Loew brought Odonkor - oh wait, that was the other thread. Yes and they are betting between Italy and Netherlands and the result is already known : 3-0 ! :rolleyes: yes surprisingly evenly matched game, especially since they play different systems and all Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aberlour10 Posted June 13, 2008 Report Share Posted June 13, 2008 Surprising lineups? Yeah I was surprised Loew brought Odonkor - oh wait, that was the other thread. Yes and they are betting between Italy and Netherlands and the result is already known : 3-0 ! :rolleyes: hmm it had to be a very close match won by 3 imps, maybe offside in decisive partscore? :rolleyes: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aberlour10 Posted June 15, 2008 Report Share Posted June 15, 2008 There are not only surprising linups, but many surprising results too at the end of the 1st day.Go San Marino Go! :rolleyes: Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickRW Posted June 16, 2008 Report Share Posted June 16, 2008 Let me stick my neck out and predict that the following teams will come through to the second stage: Group A:TurkeySpainFinlandIsraelItalyEnglandDenmarkIcelandNetherlands Group B:FranceHungaryIrelandBulgariaSwedenNorwayRussiaGermanyPoland With some results in, I'll go for: 1 ITALY2 NETHERLANDS3 FINLAND4 CZECH REP.5 ISRAEL6 ICELAND7 GREECE8 MONACO9 ENGLAND 1 SWEDEN2 GERMANY3 RUSSIA4 NORWAY5 POLAND6 BELARUS7 BULGARIA8 IRELAND9 FRANCE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nige1 Posted June 17, 2008 Report Share Posted June 17, 2008 (My team played English team two weekends ago, and one English+one Irish pair last weekend over 32 board matches. We won one by 9 and lost one by 4 and I doubt anyone seriously thinks my team could compete successfully in these championships. The amazing thing is that they somehow won the trials.) IMO Frances under-rates herself, her team, and the English team. I reckon that selectors are right to abide by trial-results. Arguably, X-imped pairs trials arrive at a better team than teams-trials but these are out of the question with playing sponsors paying the pipers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glen Posted June 17, 2008 Report Share Posted June 17, 2008 If you have two groups, and drop a bunch of teams at some point, why didn't they: Round 1: Play n boards against each team in your group-- end of round 1 - equal number of teams dropped from each groupRound 2: 2a) Team plays n boards against each team left from Round 1 group2b ) Team plays 2n boards against each team that joined from other group. Net result: team plays 2n boards against each other team in Round 2 In the current format, does Round 1 boards count at all in the top placement? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mbodell Posted June 17, 2008 Report Share Posted June 17, 2008 If you have two groups, and drop a bunch of teams at some point, why didn't they: Round 1: Play n boards against each team in your group-- end of round 1 - equal number of teams dropped from each groupRound 2: 2a) Team plays n boards against each team left from Round 1 group2b ) Team plays 2n boards against each team that joined from other group. Net result: team plays 2n boards against each other team in Round 2 In the current format, does Round 1 boards count at all in the top placement? With 6 person teams one problem with that might be that you get very different % of who plays what if one pair played all/none of the matches that were dropped. I'm sure you could correct it, but it doesn't seem to be too big a deal to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walddk Posted June 17, 2008 Report Share Posted June 17, 2008 In the current format, does Round 1 boards count at all in the top placement? No, it's a warm-up week to eliminate 10 teams from both groups. They start from scratch when the second RR begins, so it doesn't really matter if you finish 1st or 9th in RR1. Roland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulg Posted June 18, 2008 Report Share Posted June 18, 2008 In the current format, does Round 1 boards count at all in the top placement? No, it's a warm-up week to eliminate 10 teams from both groups. They start from scratch when the second RR begins, so it doesn't really matter if you finish 1st or 9th in RR1. RolandThe vugraph commentators have mentioned that Italy are only here to check out the 5* restaurants this week, they will start play next week. p Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickRW Posted June 18, 2008 Report Share Posted June 18, 2008 The vugraph commentators have mentioned that Italy are only here to check out the 5* restaurants this week, they will start play next week. p Yeah, they started well and have slipped back a little. But one can't help but think that they have just taken their foot off the gas. Or maybe not, of course, but we'll find out next week anyway. Nick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
USViking Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 I had never watched viewgraph until yesterdaysince when I have taken in a few dozen hands. It is a very nice feature, and I appreciate itsbeing made available by BBO. I have always admired Italy's consistently top to near-top performance in international events,and I look forward to following them in particular.The Noweigan defending world champs shouldalso be interesting. Something that I found suprising, make thatastonishing, was that undo is permitted not onlyon bidding but on play. I had always thoughtthat if a card hit the table then it could not betaken back. I think it should be so: if you make a mistake you should pay for it. Maybe I am missing something, but I see nodifference between undoing bid and play in bridgeand undoing a home run pitch in baseball. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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