what are these two doubles?

[mike777]

What hand type would these two doubles show you? Please give hand examples of what you think partner has.

 

Imps both vul.

 

(1c)=1s=(x)=2s

(3h)=x?

 

 

or

 

(1c) =1s=(x)=2s

(3h)=3s=p=p

(4h)=x?

 

2) Given you have:

 

QJx..Axx....JTxx...Jxx

 

does that change your mind on what pard holds?

[P_Marlowe]

#1 it shows add. strength, i.e. it is an invitation

to play 4S, but according to the rule of the

game, it can be passed

 

#2 it shows a desire to sacrifice, but if partner prefers

defending, see #1

 

The above meanings are independ of the hand I hold,

but maybe I see, that partner cant have his bid, than

I need to decide which way is safer.

 

With kind regards

Marlowe

 

PS: Given the way auction 2 developed, the meaning does

not fit, oh well.

[goobers]

the first one i would understand to be a game try if agreed as a game try, otherwise penalty

 

the second one just looks like business

[han]

1. Gametry.

 

2. This one is quite strange. Playing it as a suggestion to sacrifice makes some sense.

 

With the hand you gave I bid 4S on both auctions.

[kenrexford]

GT, then Penalty.

[neilkaz]

First double is game try since there's no inbetween suit to bid.

 

Second double is penalty for me, noting that opener just seems to have bid 4♥ competively rather than jump to it earlier, and that if I want to sac on this auction I can do so myself and that if I pass, I haven't barred PD from sac'ing (perhaps his 2♠ was based on nearly defenceless junk, but most usually I'd expect him to pass.)

[joker_gib]

GT, then Penalty.

I Agree

[Finch]

They are whatever you have agreed them to mean.

 

For me, they are both penalties.

 

The first one is game-try if you have agreed to play game-try doubles, otherwise penalties.

 

The second one looks very much like "they aren't going to make it" to me. RHO bid 3H last round, and now is bidding 4H after partner passed 3S. What is more likely: it is going off, or we want to save against it?

[mike777]

Thank you all for your replies. Of course we had not discussed what these doubles mean. On the actual hand 4s has no play and the defense is easy to find but of course many did not beat it and 4s made.

 

 

4H played from the other side is easy to beat and in fact when 4h was played it was almost always from the other side. 4H played from this side was tough to beat and in fact I did not beat it and 4hx was a dead bottom out of some 50 or 100 imp pairs or so, in this case losing 12 imps.

 

I was the x bidder(auction 2) and lead AD from AK and partner played the J of D....Qxxxx in dummy. At this point I needed to shift to my stiff h into dummies KJxxx of hearts so partner could win his ace and shoot a spade through.

 

Dummy had something like:

 

xx....KJ9xx...Q9xxx.....x