an easy one

[jillybean]

Dealer: South Vul: NS Scoring: IMP ♠ QT97 ♥ A75 ♦ KQ ♣ AQJ4

 

West North East South

 

 -     -     -     1♣

 Pass  2NT   Pass  ?

You open 1♣ in first seat - pass - 2nt back to you?

 

 

 

Bonus question:

 

What does 3♥ mean to you in this auction?

(P) P (P) 1♥

(2♣) 3♥

[vuroth]

Easy?

 

Playing "SAYC", I bid 4NT, since they've promised 13-15.

 

Playing SAYC with a partner I know, I bid 3NT, since everyone seems to take 2NT as invitational, not GF.

 

V

[skjaeran]

With anyone but my regular partner 2NT would be invitational, thus I raise to 3NT.

 

With my regular 2NT shows 13+ (15-17 3343/3334 would bid a direct 3NT), with him I'd raise to 4NT.

[kenrexford]

Initial Question: What after 1♣-P-2NT-P-?

 

I'm not sure what 2NT shows in your methods. We are obviously bidding at least 3NT, so the question seems to be whether a slam is possible.

 

Most people play that 1NT after a 1♣ opening shows about 8-11. So, I'd assume at least 12, whatever you are playing. So, is there a 12-count where slam is possible?

 

I want to have the diamond Ace from partner, as this is a particularly nice card, allowing me to likely ditch one slow heart loser. I also want a club fit, which seems fairly likely. The diamond Ace, club King, and spade A-K would make 6♣ a virtual laydown, for 14 HCP. I might even ditch TWO hearts on diamonds (e.g., AJxx). But, perhaps 14 is too much (12-13). 6♣ on a hook might be making, such as replacing the spade King with the spade Jack or not having the club King. That makes an 11-count plausible for slam.

 

Something like:

 

♠AKx ♥xxx ♦Axx ♣Jxxx or

♠AJx ♥xxx ♦Axx ♣Kxxx

 

But, we still seem to need a club fit and a good split, making this seem less than 50%. Removing other cards really attentuates the hand.

 

That, and what to bid, convince me to bid 3NT unless 2NT was different than what I expect -- a great 11 to a bad 13. If I am wrong (e.g., 13-15), then some slam move makes sense. 4NT makes sense, unless you have some strange tools available.

 

Bonus Question:

 

For me, this is a "limix" raise of a fourth-seat opening (5-card support, some shortness value, and 5-8 HCP).

[jillybean]

Playing 'SAYC' 2nt "should" be 13-15 GF but many seem to play this as 11+, unless 3nt is the right spot I more often than not end up in a wrong contract after the auction starts 1m:2nt.

 

And 2nt:4nt seems to be a constant source of confusion.

[jdonn]

Playing 'SAYC' 2nt "should" be 13-15 GF but many seem to play this as 11+, unless 3nt is the right spot I more often than not end up in a wrong contract after the auction starts 1m:2nt.

 

And 2nt:4nt seems to be a constant source of confusion.

If 2NT is 13-15 this is an easy 4NT bid to invite slam. If partner won't understand 4NT then I guess I bid 3NT since a partner who doesn't know an obvious quantitative 4NT probably won't be able to make an easy slam either :)

[han]

I think most play 2NT invitational, so we have an easy 3NT bid.

[neilkaz]

Playing 'SAYC' 2nt "should" be 13-15 GF but many seem to play this as 11+, unless 3nt is the right spot I more often than not end up in a wrong contract after the auction starts 1m:2nt.

 

And 2nt:4nt seems to be a constant source of confusion.

If 2NT is 13-15 this is an easy 4NT bid to invite slam. If partner won't understand 4NT then I guess I bid 3NT since a partner who doesn't know an obvious quantitative 4NT probably won't be able to make an easy slam either :)

We agree.

 

It's fun to agree full SAYC with some pick up in MBC and then ask if 1♣ followed by a 2NT response is 11-12 or 13-15 and get no answer from an obvious English speaker.

 

Most people play 11-12 but there's the few that play 13-15 so in practice when I've agreed SAYC (ie they don't play 2/1 GF) I almost always raise there 2NT to 3NT and try to make game just incase PD can make it with 23 HCP or just incase they have 13-15 !

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

 

assuming 2NT show 10-12 bal, I bid 3NT.

 

3H would show a 2-suiter, I would say, that

it shows 6-5, but it may just be a adv. cue

bid.

 

With kind regards

Marlowe

[jillybean]

Playing 'SAYC' 2nt "should" be 13-15 GF but many seem to play this as 11+, unless 3nt is the right spot I more often than not end up in a wrong contract after the auction starts 1m:2nt.

 

And 2nt:4nt seems to be a constant source of confusion.

If 2NT is 13-15 this is an easy 4NT bid to invite slam. If partner won't understand 4NT then I guess I bid 3NT since a partner who doesn't know an obvious quantitative 4NT probably won't be able to make an easy slam either :)

3nt/6nt ,You are playing it B)

[pclayton]

Standard meaning of 2N is invitational. We have an unremarkable 18 so we bid game. By the way, I like 3x (x = higher than opener's suit) as shortness.

 

Ken, I wouldn't characterize 1♣ - 1N as 8-11 as being standard. I know a lot of bridge teachers advocate this (8-10 really) but this was taught before the days we would overcall at the one level on cheese. You are forced to bid 1♦ on a 3, even a 2 card suit, which is amazing to me. I've never believed that 8-10/11 is playable.

 

It's funny, the only people that play 2N as forcing are beginners that know Goren and very accomplished players that have an alternative call for a balanced invite B)

[vuroth]

It's funny, the only people that play 2N as forcing are beginners that know Goren and very accomplished players that have an alternative call for a balanced invite :P

Which is what makes it so frustrating for 2NT forcing to be in SAYC....