disaster

[jillybean]

[hv=d=s&v=n&n=sa64h94djt65ct632&w=st3hkq5dq93ckq974&e=sj98752hjt32dkca8&s=skqha876da8742cj5]399|300|Scoring: IMP[/hv]

 

West North East South

 

 -     -     -     1♦

 2♣    Pass  2♠    Pass

 2NT   Pass  3♥    Pass

 3NT   Pass  4♠    Pass

 Pass  Pass  

[han]

I assume that you have read the frequent discussions about whether 2S should be forcing here or not. If the experts can't agree on this, it is not surprising that less experienced players might get overboard sometimes when one player thinks 2S is non-forcing, and the other thinks it is forcing.

 

That having said, I think the 2C overcall is pretty awful. 3NT doesn't seem right either, I would have bid 3S. So I fully blame west. East doesn't have a great hand but I think I would have bid a non-forcing 2S.

 

So I'm giving west 100% of the blame.

[mikeh]

I must have missed the frequent discussions of whether 2♠ could be played as non-forcing: I have never seen it treated that way, and don't think it is playable. Of course, as someone who plays transfer advances, in many auctions, it isn't that much of a big deal... but I would not expect B/I players to even consider transfer advances.

 

Having said that, I would stretch to bid 2(forcing)♠ as East, because my Ax of clubs isn't exactly chopped liver, and I hold a stiff diamond. Opposite a mediocre hand with a fit, 4♠ will have play: Axx xx Ax KJxxxx gives me a shot and he could well have a far better hand.. meanwhile, I'll pay to the hands on which 3♣ is too high and 2♣ wasn't. Plus, if partner, over 2♠, bids 2N, I'll at least think about 3N.... expecting 6 clubs, 2 diamonds and a major suit winner in the wash.. that club A and (after 2N) the diamond K are huge.

 

But I wouldn't have overcalled 2♣. I am a big fan of aggressive 2♣ overcalls of a 1♦ opening, but this hand simply isn't good enough. I'd question it even with an extra club... but on a KQ9xx suit? Not a chance.

 

Then 3N over 3♥ is just plain silly... wtf is wrong with 3♠? Overcaller has already announced a diamond stopper, and Qxx isn't exactly the diamond holding of the year, and denied as many as 3 spades... just what did West think 3♠ now would show??

 

So the blame, for me, goes 100% to west.

[Codo]

I am a much biger fan of overcalling 2 ♣, so I like this call. Pd must just expect me to have a bad hand for this bid.

2 Spade forcing was a stretch, but I like it for Mikes reasons.

2 NT was dubious, but you have to life with this if you overcall with bad hands.

I dislike 3 Heart, because this sounds much stronger then 3 Spade.

I hate 3 NT, because 3 Spade is the only sane bid.

 

So it is still 80/20 for West.

[Cascade]

I wouldn't bid 2♣.

 

On its own this bid is almost completely to blame for getting east west too high.

[whereagles]

I'm ok with 2♣ but only because of its obstructive value.

 

Anyway, I think 2♠ is forcing and was a correct bid. Now over 2NT, it's better not to overbid again: either or 3♣ or pass. 3♥/3♠ is liveable, but with the mild club support it's better not to insist on such raggy suits.

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

 

for me 2S would be nonforcing, so 2S would

be fine, athough I may pass instead of bidding

2S, because the suit quality is dishusting, but

it is close, afterall it is a 6 carder.

 

It depends to large degree, what you expect

for a min 2c overcall.

 

I would certainly pass a nonforcing 2S bid with

the west hand.

After 2NT I would bid 3S, partner promised 2

spades but does not know yet that I have a 6

carder.

You found a fit in the mayors, show it.

The problem with 3H is, that it is most likely

non-forcing, and partner may or may not pass

with 3 hearts and 2 spades (he should not, but

who knows).

 

With kind regards

Marlowe

[the hog]

2C is pretty disgusting, but maybe excusable because the opening is 1D. It would be unconscionable over 1M. I would also play 2S as nf and would pass that, (would prefer to play Rubens Advances though.)

[Finch]

Some calls are a matter of judgement and style, and some are wrong.

 

In reverse order:

 

3NT is just plain wrong. You have a minimum, you have already shown a diamond stop. No other call but 3♠ is possible here. 3♠ doesn't make, but at least it's a decent save against the NS contract of 3♦ (why didn't North raise his partner's opening?).

 

3♥ I don't like, but it could work. I prefer a simple 3C bid, but then my partner's 2-level overcalls are often a 6-card suit. I don't really like passing 2NT.

 

2NT is pretty much forced if 2S is forcing. If 2S is non-forcing, then you have a very easy pass.

 

2S I agree with whether it is forcing or not. (I have always played these as forcing, but I do know some people don't.)

 

I don't like the 2C overcall, particularly given the diamond holding. Yes, it uses up a lot of space, but I still don't like it. If you think this is a normal overcall, then play change of suit by advancer as non-forcing, and you can play in 2S.

[awm]

I can see the 2♣ call. You are white/red and it takes up a lot of space.

 

I think the 4♠ bid may actually be the worst call of the auction. East has a terrible suit, help in clubs, and help in diamonds. Why not leave it at 3NT? Partner could easily have singleton spade.

 

Of course, this pair was already doomed to a poor result before the 4♠ bid, because of the second worst call of the auction, 3NT. Why not 3♠? You've already denied a real spade fit by not raising 2♠, and the diamond stopper is lousy.

 

As pointed out by others, down one is okay on this board.

[Apollo81]

Does everyone think 3♥ is forcing? I think I'd have passed, put down my dummy, and said GLP (why cant P be 5-5?). For that matter do people think 2NT is forcing? I wouldn't have thought that either. I think with a good majors hand, RHO can bid 3♦ or 4♥

 

I tend to think bids are NF if there is doubt. 2♠ I'd interpret as forcing of course.

[jillybean]

I haven't read the discussions re 2♠ is forcing here or not. Unfortunately I can't keep up with all the threads. I have always played it as forcing.

I see I need to be more disciplined with my 2 level overcalls, again.