Echognome Posted March 4, 2008 Report Share Posted March 4, 2008 [hv=d=n&v=b&e=sa5haq83dj873ct74&s=sj72hjt976dqt962c]266|200|Scoring: IMPP - P - P - 1♠P - 2♦ - P - 3♣P - 3N - P - 4♣P - 4♠ - P - 6♠P - P - Dbl - All Pass[/hv] You make a lightner double as south and partner (an expert) leads the ♠4 to dummy's A and your 2. Although you are disappointed with the lead, you are surprised when declarer next leads the ♣T off of dummy. Do you ruff? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TylerE Posted March 4, 2008 Report Share Posted March 4, 2008 Ruff and switch to a ♦ Probably wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pclayton Posted March 4, 2008 Report Share Posted March 4, 2008 Apparently pard thought his clubs were better put to use to not give us ruffs. It's difficult to balance a West hand that drives to slam opposite a passed hand with a pard that doesn't lead a club. For instance I think the non club lead would imply HHxxx in clubs, but that seems really unlikely here. I will credit declarer with 6 spade tricks, two heart tricks and the AK♣. Declarer either has the ♦A or a void. Lets give declarer the ♥K too. We guard the hearts over dummy, so a squeeze won't operate in this instance. I'm having a hard time constructing a hand where my play matters. It seems that we are scoring either two clubs or a club and a ruff no matter what I do. If the purpose of this hand is to extract -2 or -3 then I don't think its a big deal either way. I will pitch on general principles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jlall Posted March 4, 2008 Report Share Posted March 4, 2008 I will pitch on general principles. Lol, exactly. Perhaps it's lazy but I wouldn't even think about it at all, it is always right to pitch in these scenarios. Maybe it's wrong this time and that's why you're posting the hand :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dake50 Posted March 5, 2008 Report Share Posted March 5, 2008 D-void scared them off 6NT, partner has SQ single + C-bothering honor. Pitch and witness this masterful play if it makes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codo Posted March 5, 2008 Report Share Posted March 5, 2008 Sorry if I have to ask, but:Why exactly did the double ask for a club lead? I thought that there are two (shortend) definitions for Lightner X: Lead the first suit from dummy OR lead something unusual. Without discussion I had belived that partner will lead diamonds after my double. But if I had known that my double just asked for something unusual, I would surely discard now. I will trust partner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewj Posted March 5, 2008 Report Share Posted March 5, 2008 Count me in for not ruffing in as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gnasher Posted March 5, 2008 Report Share Posted March 5, 2008 I thought that there are two (shortend) definitions for Lightner X: Lead the first suit from dummy OR lead something unusual. Without discussion I had belived that partner will lead diamonds after my double. But if I had known that my double just asked for something unusual, I would surely discard now. I will trust partner. I prefer to play that double simply says "give me a ruff", and leaves your partner to work out which suit it's in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uday Posted March 5, 2008 Report Share Posted March 5, 2008 My P led a trump after a lead-directing double. I won't quibble with his self rating but now declarer is doing something odd as well. Unless P and declarer are regular partners, declarer at knows I'm void in C and doesnt mind the ruff, so it seems prudent to discard. Luckily the discard will have to come from a red suit so P will realize that I'm out of clubs :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cherdano Posted March 5, 2008 Report Share Posted March 5, 2008 Luckily the discard will have to come from a red suit so P will realize that I'm out of clubs :) Good point I missed that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fluffy Posted March 5, 2008 Report Share Posted March 5, 2008 Its hard to imagine how ruffing might cost, I will ruff if LHO is not good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jlall Posted March 5, 2008 Report Share Posted March 5, 2008 Its hard to imagine how ruffing might cost, I will ruff if LHO is not good. Maybe you will rectify the count for some squeeze? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gnasher Posted March 5, 2008 Report Share Posted March 5, 2008 Its hard to imagine how ruffing might cost, I will ruff if LHO is not good. Maybe you will rectify the count for some squeeze? I can't see how he couldn't achieve the same effect by drawing trumps and ducking a club. One risk is that we're ruffing with a trump trick, say when declarer has K109xxx K A AKJxx and partner Qx xxx Kxx Qxxxx. In that case partner has done astonishingly well in ignoring our demand for a club ruff, which would have let it through. It seems natural on general principles to discard, but I'd be uncomfortable about doing so without being able to think of any believable layout where's it right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fluffy Posted March 5, 2008 Report Share Posted March 5, 2008 Its hard to imagine how ruffing might cost, I will ruff if LHO is not good. Maybe you will rectify the count for some squeeze? Good, I knew there should be an excuse not to ruff when LHO is good :P, but I don't know why declarer has some urge to do it at this point as Gnasher points. Gnasher, I think blowing a trick in trumps is impossible, partner led a trump, with ♠Q4 I don't think he would, at least none of my partners do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cherdano Posted March 5, 2008 Report Share Posted March 5, 2008 Gnasher, I think blowing a trick in trumps is impossible, partner led a trump, with ♠Q4 I don't think he would, at least none of my partners do. It seems also highly unlikely that declarer would go up with the ace if he has KT9xxx. (A trump lead from Jx doesn't seem impossible.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Echognome Posted March 5, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 5, 2008 [hv=d=e&v=n&n=st4hk542d54cq8652&w=skq9863hdakcakj93&e=sa5haq83dj873ct74&s=sj72hjt976dqt962c]399|300|Scoring: IMP[/hv] Ruff or not, still goes down... unless you let it make. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gnasher Posted March 5, 2008 Report Share Posted March 5, 2008 Gnasher, I think blowing a trick in trumps is impossible, partner led a trump, with ♠Q4 I don't think he would, at least none of my partners do. Good point. Now that I remember how trick one went, I can't think of any layout where ruffing costs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeh Posted March 6, 2008 Report Share Posted March 6, 2008 Dealer: East Vul: N/S Scoring: IMP ♠ T4 ♥ K542 ♦ 54 ♣ Q8652 ♠ KQ9863 ♥ [space] ♦ AK ♣ AKJ93 ♠ A5 ♥ AQ83 ♦ J873 ♣ T74 ♠ J72 ♥ JT976 ♦ QT962 ♣ [space] Ruff or not, still goes down... unless you let it make.you're kidding, right? declarer led the club 10????? Before cashing the ♥A... which would at least rendered your play relevant B) Oh, I forgot.. this declarer would probably have pitched a diamond on the heart A B) Where do you find these opps? :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jlall Posted March 6, 2008 Report Share Posted March 6, 2008 I was actually declarer on this hand, I hate to admit it. I misread what was happening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
han Posted March 6, 2008 Report Share Posted March 6, 2008 I was watching, I didn't get your play at all Justin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdonn Posted March 6, 2008 Report Share Posted March 6, 2008 Yes where do you find these crazy opps! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gnasher Posted March 6, 2008 Report Share Posted March 6, 2008 I was actually declarer on this hand, I hate to admit it. I misread what was happening. I'm not sure that that's a sufficient excuse. If you were worried that South had a trump trick, you could find out by cashing two trumps ending in dummy. Once you discovered that trumps were breaking, you could then ruff a heart to hand, draw trumps, and lead clubs from hand. What was North on? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jlall Posted March 6, 2008 Report Share Posted March 6, 2008 I was actually declarer on this hand, I hate to admit it. I misread what was happening. I'm not sure that that's a sufficient excuse. If you were worried that South had a trump trick, you could find out by cashing two trumps ending in dummy. Once you discovered that trumps were breaking, you could then ruff a heart to hand, draw trumps, and lead clubs from hand. What was North on? lol I was joking (it wasnt me) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gnasher Posted March 6, 2008 Report Share Posted March 6, 2008 lol I was joking (it wasnt me) Ah. What's the smiley for looking foolish? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skjaeran Posted March 6, 2008 Report Share Posted March 6, 2008 I'm counting on partner to be able to see my void. Thus he'll be expecting ♣ trick(s) in his own hand when leading a club. So I'll discard a diamond on general principles. The real hand is just crazy though. Not leading a ♣ with the north hand is quite hopeless, and declarers play is totally insane, to put it mildly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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