expert advice

[geofspa]

For my 2 pennyworth I agree with Wayne 100% Partnership agreements and knowing how your agreements work are worth more than any "system" of bidding.

 

This is very true for a regular partnership which should hold regular postmortems of their play - and practice together at the partnership tables within BBO.

 

Now on the other hand in pickup partnerships I am a great believer in the KISS system. (Keep It Simple i'm Stupid). I much prefer to agree any natural system with very limited conventions - Stayman, Red suit transfers, Blackwood may be 3 I would like - and if SAYC fits the bill for you then stick with it.

 

Geof

[han]

I don't believe that a team of gerber-only players can win the Vanderbilt these days. I agree that other skills are more important but let's not pretend that system is not at all relevant, it is.

[Cascade]

I don't believe that a team of gerber-only players can win the Vanderbilt these days. I agree that other skills are more important but let's not pretend that system is not at all relevant, it is.

I don't want to burst Kathryn's bubble but I don't think there are many Beginner/Intermediates who have the immediate aim of winning the Vanderbilt.

 

Even so ...

 

I still believe agreements are much more important than the front end system.

[jtfanclub]

I don't want to burst Kathryn's bubble but I don't think there are many Beginner/Intermediates who have the immediate aim of winning the Vanderbilt.

And yet, there I shall be next Sunday.

[blackshoe]

What results do you get playing SAYC? Are you consistently in the money? Are you consistently under 50% at MPs? If the latter, there's a problem. It may or may not be the system you play, though. Keep track of your bad boards. Examine them with an eye toward why]/i] they were bad. If it was a bidding problem, then it may have been system – there are unbiddable hands for any system. Or it may have been a misunderstanding on the part of one or both of you. You can work on fixing that without changing system. Look at your defense – are you communicating okay? Do your inferences make sense? Does your declarer play need work? All of these things should take precedence, imo, over a change of system.

 

That's not to say I think SAYC is a good system - of all the systems I know, including some but not all of the ones I know not at all well, SAYC is last on my list. I'd almost rather play MOSCITO, a system I know hardly at all. B)

[whereagles]

SAYC is playable. Its shortcomings aren't enough to make a decisive difference in overall performance. 2/1 also has its shortcomings.

[vuroth]

That's not to say I think SAYC is a good system - of all the systems I know, including some but not all of the ones I know not at all well, SAYC is last on my list. I'd almost rather play MOSCITO, a system I know hardly at all. :)

I think a valid question is - how many BILs now SAYC well?

 

I'm pretty sure that I don't, yet.

 

V

[the hog]

SAYC is playable. Its shortcomings aren't enough to make a decisive difference in overall performance. 2/1 also has its shortcomings.

What is 2/1 anyway? Some people play weird stuff like reverses not showing extra values, and sequences like 1S 2C 2D 2S as setting the suit and being a slam try! Others play more workable stuff. Some play serious, some play frivolous and some don't play either. Some bid 1H 2C with a 4324 hand others don't.

[han]

Agree with the Hog.

[rogerclee]

I voted for yes, but:

 

If you are a beginner: Do not learn 2/1. There are so many other things that I am sure would improve your game by tons before learning system stuff. Learn how to bid in a competitive auction. Learn when to invite game and when to accept game. Learn how to defend properly and count. Learn how to deal with preempts. Don't worry about system; it is the least of your worries.

 

If you are an intermediate player: Learn 2/1. It is basically so standard that finding partners to play SA is actually much harder. This is not to say that learning 2/1 will dramatically improve your game; I guarantee you it will not. It is just a practical matter that you really need to play 2/1 to form new partnerships. If you really are an intermediate player, you should have no trouble learning the basic mechanics of a 2/1 system.

[skjaeran]

If you are a beginner: Do not learn 2/1. There are so many other things that I am sure would improve your game by tons before learning system stuff. Learn how to bid in a competitive auction. Learn when to invite game and when to accept game. Learn how to defend properly and count. Learn how to deal with preempts. Don't worry about system; it is the least of your worries.

 

If you are an intermediate player: Learn 2/1. It is basically so standard that finding partners to play SA is actually much harder. This is not to say that learning 2/1 will dramatically improve your game; I guarantee you it will not. It is just a practical matter that you really need to play 2/1 to form new partnerships. If you really are an intermediate player, you should have no trouble learning the basic mechanics of a 2/1 system.

I totally agree with the first paragraph.

 

The 2nd paragraph I also agree with, if you play in the ACBL or online. If you play f2f in most parts of Europe 2/1 won't make it easier to form new partnerships - what would will vary.

 

In Norway you should learn Norwegian Standard - basically a modernised Acol-based system, 4c suit up-the-line bidding (5443 opening style) and 2/1 F1 to be able to play with most people or a 2/1 light 5cM T-Walsh to play with the best juniors (this approach is spreading).