2S weak after partner passed

[kgr]

[hv=d=n&v=e&s=sat8532hj8dat4ck6]133|100|Scoring: IMP

Pass-(1C)-?[/hv]

Partner passed. Do you consider bidding a weak 2♠ with this hand?

If not: what is the minimum change you need to bid 2♠?

thanks,

Koen

[655321]

1♠ for me.

If your partnership has decided to play like this, you could decide to bid 2♠ here, at favorable and with partner being a passed hand, but with a good hand I prefer to make my normal bid.

If you do routinely bid 2♠ here with good hands whenever partner has passed, then you are not really playing weak jumps, IMO. Bidding this way is a legitimate style, just not the one I prefer.

[kgr]

If you do routinely bid 2♠ here with good hands whenever partner has passed, then you are not really playing weak jumps, IMO.

Partner is pickup on BBO. No agreements.

The idea is to bid 2♠ with 5 or 6 spades and 0 to 12 (13?) pts...Any hand you don't see a lot chanche to make game with a passed partner. Only make it more difficult for opps.

...but maybe this hand is too good?

[mike777]

1s

 

1) We have lots of chances for game.

2) I want partner to know I may have defense if we defend not pure off. hand.

[helene_t]

Let's give p some random 10-count:

KQx-xxxx-KQx-xxx makes 4♠ with ♣A on-side

Qx-Axxx-Qxxx-Qxx probably makes 2♠

 

I think the chance of missing a game is quite low. I would bid 2♠ at favorable. No idea if it's right but preempting is fun.

[pclayton]

1♠. Missing game isn't the issue here. Preempting with a lousy suit and outside defense is.

 

Do you pard to sac over 4♥ with 4 spades and an outside card? I sure don't.

[han]

1S, really dislike 2S.

[kenrexford]

I firmly believe that the faster you get to 2♠ in this sequence, the better.

 

The corollary is that 1♠ shows more serious game interest.

 

That said, the diamond 10 has me troubled. I initially clicked 2♠, but I wish to change my vote, like a superdelegate, to 1♠, but only because of the diamond 10.

[gwnn]

2♠ is horrible with this hand.

 

closest to this one is I think

 

KQT853

J8

AT4

65

.

 

ATxxxx is bad for a preempt. It's just not good. Just bad. Try to avoid it.

[whereagles]

2♠. Opposite a passed pard, you can (perhaps should) randomize your jump overcalls a bit. Make sure u tell pard to bid only with a fit :D

[gwnn]

One of the biggest problems I've seen low ODR WJO's cause is the preempt getting passed out and you getting to a lousy contract. You have about 19 hcp, you would have belonged to another contract, they can make nothing.

[jdonn]

I have stated before that I simply don't understand this trend in some circles to preempt after partner passed on hands that are

 

- very good

and (even moreso)

- not preemptive in nature!

 

You are probably just racking up small losses when they let you play there or partner misjudges without any compensating large gains.

[skjaeran]

This hand is just a little too good offensively to overcall 2♠. We might still have game. But this is a minor flaw compared with:

 

The hand is far too good defensively. With 2.5 (or even more) defensive tricks, making a wjo will far too often induce partner to make the wrong decision over 4♥, making a phantom save.

 

So this is a clear 1♠ to me.

[Cascade]

1♠ game is too likely as is a penalty if i bid 2♠

[P_Marlowe]

2S, but 1S is normal, but even 3S may work

out sometimes, although the suit quality is to

bad.

 

The best you can is to vary your bids, open 1S

most of the time, but 2S sometimes.

 

With kind regards

Marlowe

[P_Marlowe]

If you do routinely bid 2♠ here with good hands whenever partner has passed, then you are not really playing weak jumps, IMO.

Partner is pickup on BBO. No agreements.

The idea is to bid 2♠ with 5 or 6 spades and 0 to 12 (13?) pts...Any hand you don't see a lot chanche to make game with a passed partner. Only make it more difficult for opps.

...but maybe this hand is too good?

If you are playing with a pickup, than 1S

is clear cut.

 

1) you keep tensions low, if you are taking normal

actions

2) you know beforehand, how a given auction my

likely develop

The intention to bid 2S is to play games with the

opponents, this means, your partner should

stay out, if you have no idea, if this particular

player will stay out of your way, dont test him

 

With kind regards

Marlowe

[joker_gib]

1♠ obvious for me with this defense

[kgr]

Thanks all for the answers.

(Very interersting comments I found that this hand has too much defence for 2S)

This is the full story:

[hv=d=n&v=e&n=skj97hk643dk98c95&s=sat8532hj8dat4ck6]133|200|Scoring: IMP

P-(1C)-2S-All Pass[/hv]

Making 2♠+2.

LHO was table host and he removed me after this hand, telling me that 2♠ was a Novice bid.

[kenrexford]

A bit of a harsh reaction, considering that most experts make bids at times that even they in retrospect would admit to be "novice" bids.

[P_Marlowe]

<snip>

LHO was table host and he removed me after this hand, telling me that 2♠ was a Novice bid.

Be grateful, it would not have been fun anyway

playing at this table.

 

With kind regards

Marlowe

[gwnn]

LHO is interesting cause usually people don't tend to care about their opps' mistakes:) see also "reset score pls", whenever their initial score is negative.

 

btw it's not a novice bid, novices and experts tend to use the same wjo's :) the people in between usually try to mix them up, with small success. if anything, experts retain their real high odr wjos NV like KJT9x x xxx JTxx over 1m, novices would usually not think about it.

[benlessard]

I like your 2S bid i dont think missing game is that likely and im not afraid of 2S X. I dont care too much about ODR and AT8xxx is enough suit quality for W vs R.

 

I agree that sometimes we will make a phantom but sometimes sac will be cheap.

 

I suspect most of the overcaller would rebid 2S over (2C or 2H) in my sense its much safer to jump to 2S right away + you can also bury a H fit. Its enough compensation for some games that you will missed.

 

Also 4S is still reachable, for this hand partner had a clear 3C bid and you have an easy accept.

[Guest Jlall]

FWIW I think 2S with this hand is suicidal, will cause partner's competitive judgement to be bad (he will take phantom saves because we have too much D or not compete to 3 when we can make because he's scared to push them into a game etc), too committal on strain (we could belong anywhere and commit to spades with such a bad suit), etc etc the usual :P Really if you are looking to improve as a bridge player just bid 1S with this and dont randomize your results on normal hands like this one.

[mikeh]

This hand is just a little too good offensively to overcall 2♠. We might still have game. But this is a minor flaw compared with:

 

The hand is far too good defensively. With 2.5 (or even more) defensive tricks, making a wjo will far too often induce partner to make the wrong decision over 4♥, making a phantom save.

 

So this is a clear 1♠ to me.

agree

[whereagles]

A bit unlucky. Most of the time pard won't have a hand where game makes. On this particular layout, you still have a lot of work to do.