flytoox Posted February 22, 2004 Report Share Posted February 22, 2004 non vs vul. you hold;S:AXH:KT96XD:KT98XC:A RHO as the dealer,opened 2s, what do you do now? fly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WGF_Flame Posted February 22, 2004 Report Share Posted February 22, 2004 my answer is 3H.First of all, you have to bid something (other then pass)2nt is natural (not a two suiter) so u have a choice between two bids, 3h and DIf u plan on doubling u got to be sure that if u correct parnter's 3cl into 3d ur p will understand u got dimond and hearts, and not a super dimond one suiter, even if u play this method (which is imo the right one) i would still bid 3h imidiatly since this bid is simpler and i do feel good about bidding 4d. i prefer to leave those doubles for 4-5, and bid directly with such nice suits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hrothgar Posted February 22, 2004 Report Share Posted February 22, 2004 non vs vul. you hold;S:AXH:KT96XD:KT98XC:A RHO as the dealer,opened 2s, what do you do now? fly 4 DiamondsWhats the problem? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inquiry Posted February 22, 2004 Report Share Posted February 22, 2004 4♦ - next... playing misho's meta overcalls, some discussion will be needed, as 3♦ shows the red two suiter here also...so does 4♦ show better red two suiter or now no longer leaping michaels. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trpltrbl Posted February 22, 2004 Report Share Posted February 22, 2004 If playing leaping Micheals I will bid 4♦ otherwise I will start with 3♥. Mike :angry: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the hog Posted February 23, 2004 Report Share Posted February 23, 2004 Gack! I am out of synch with most people on this. I just don't think the suits are good enough for Leaping Michaels, which forces us to the 4 level. I would bid 3H. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inquiry Posted February 23, 2004 Report Share Posted February 23, 2004 Gack! I am out of synch with most people on this. I just don't think the suits are good enough for Leaping Michaels, which forces us to the 4 level. I would bid 3H. Hehehe... You haven't read the Bridge World article (decades old) on "liberal leaping michaels". This hand is almost too good for that bid...... the recommendation (I think the article was by capelletti, but it has been a long, long time) was something like good 9 or 11 hcp as a minimum, if 5-5.... This is "sound" by those standards. For what it is worth, I have been using liberal leaping michaels ever since then with almost universal good results (I have had a couple bad boards but the good way out weighs the bad). Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joker_gib Posted February 23, 2004 Report Share Posted February 23, 2004 3♥ is not that hand and the preempt increases chances to find a good fit and HCP in partner's hand. So, even if the colours are relatively poor, I would bid 4♦ Michaels showing ♦ and ♥ :huh: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mishovnbg Posted February 23, 2004 Report Share Posted February 23, 2004 4♦ - next... playing misho's meta overcalls, some discussion will be needed, as 3♦ shows the red two suiter here also...so does 4♦ show better red two suiter or now no longer leaping michaels. ..................................................Hi Ben!.........................................................Normal bid is 4♦ ofcourse. Ben, in my opinion difference between 3♦ meta and 4♦ lmich is 3♦ is not forcing and show probably longer ♦ suit, while 4♦ is forcing F1R. If you have 2 way to show hand, like us, question is which one is stronger? In my opinion 2 suiter is very good with fit and very bad without fit. This mean leaping/normall michael/U2NT must be stronger or more distributional than meta. .........................................................................Misho Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inquiry Posted February 23, 2004 Report Share Posted February 23, 2004 Thanks for the reply Misho, I am sure others thinking about trying your META overcalls appreciate the clarification too... it makes sense that 3♦ and 4♦ are treated as you suggest, which is what I was thinking too. Two other observations, The_hog and hrogthar are frequent parntners and both 4♦ as Leaping Michaels, but with different minimumum requirements as this hand reflects. It takes a long while to get down the nuances of a partnership as to minimum requirements for some bids. And in this thread was joker_gib's 8th post. Althouigh he is new to the forum, his post to date to the play problem (Northfork one) and the two bidding problems (this one and respond to the takeout double) and his thread on forcing pass situations have already shown he will be a wonderful addition to our posting community. Welcome again, joker_gib. Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joker_gib Posted February 23, 2004 Report Share Posted February 23, 2004 :) Well, tx a lot for your kind consideration Ben ! Bridge is a very difficult game (I can be brilliant but also very bad :( ) and that's why we like it so much. But, may I ask a question, more particularly to you and Misho : Could you give me an overview of what you call "Meta overcalls" ? Tx in advance, Alain Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inquiry Posted February 23, 2004 Report Share Posted February 23, 2004 Hi Alain Meta overcalls is a work in progress that, as far as I can tell, was invented by misho. He posted a short description on it at the following link... http://bridgebase.lunarpages.com/~bridge2/...ic=1438&hl=meta To play meta overcalls, you will distort everything you are use to playing. I have been playing meta overcalls with Misho for a little while, and have some remarkable successes, and some humiliating failures. In part because there is a learning curve, and what I assume certain competitive auctions mean after a meta auction is not necessarily what Misho assumes. Also, it fights against the normal reflex to not bid 2♦ over 1♥ holding either... [hv=s=sxxhkxxdaqj952ckx]133|100|[/hv], or[hv=s=sxxhkxxdaqj952ckx]133|100|[/hv] With the first one, you bid 1NT showing a minor suited hand and a ♥ stopper, and with number 2, you double to show a minor suited hand without a stopper. Both of these bids tend to strongly deny a major. But more importantly, you MUST NOT bid 2♦ with either as that promises a ♠ suit as well as ♦'s. But against this, you can easily handle hands that others use raptor like bids on, because to bid a new minor is essentially a DONT like bid, showing the bid minor and a major. Over 1 of a suit, these bids work well and I have not missed the natural 1NT bid (well, to tell the truth, I always preferred raptor anyway, so no bid loss). Also, it helps with preempts when you have two suits, including one major, as you have "leaping michaels" available, even without a leap. But how to bid some other hands is still a little fuzzy in my mind. One thing for sure, you have to think before every bid... :-) Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trpltrbl Posted February 24, 2004 Report Share Posted February 24, 2004 Gack! I am out of synch with most people on this. I just don't think the suits are good enough for Leaping Michaels, which forces us to the 4 level. I would bid 3H. I have to mostly agree with this, depends on state of my mind which way I would bid. But both red suits have nice intermediates. Like I said depends on state of my mind and how match is going. But 4 ♦ still slight favorite... Mike :( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mishovnbg Posted February 24, 2004 Report Share Posted February 24, 2004 :D Well, tx a lot for your kind consideration Ben ! Bridge is a very difficult game (I can be brilliant but also very bad :D ) and that's why we like it so much. But, may I ask a question, more particularly to you and Misho : Could you give me an overview of what you call "Meta overcalls" ? Tx in advance, Alain ..................................................Hi Alain!............................................................Welcome to forum! Will be nice, if you add your comments too, because meta overcall structure is still under construction (and under question too :angry: ) Name: META because same structure is available everywhere, after any bid include any transfer/artifical bid or NT opening. Basis: Mekstrot-Rodwell defense against strong NT Target: Better partnership understanding due to often usage of meta overcall structure Advantage: NT contracts impossible to reach by normall overcalls. Disadvantage: Missing possible minor contract/lead....Note: All what Ben was posted is true, but missing explanation for bal hands. You must bid them like minor hands - 1NT or dbl if missing stop....Note: I will post suggestion for responses to same overcalls..................................................................................Misho Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joker_gib Posted February 24, 2004 Report Share Posted February 24, 2004 Hi Misho, Ben and others... I had a look at your META overcall structure and it is a very interesting concept but what I don't like in these kind of methods in that you never know the exact minimum number of cards in suits so that it's therefore difficult to take decisions (not playing in your best fit, preempt related to the law of total tricks....). That's also the reason why I don't like to play DONT on opps NT openings. Tx a lot anyway for your explanations ! :D Alain Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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