Reverse Flannery disaster

[twcho]

I held J7xxx 98xx A8x T, white vs red, imp.

 

Pard opened in 1st position with 1♦. Our partnership has just agreed to play reverse flannery so this was the perfect hand to start with this toy and I responded 2♥.

 

LHO overcalled 2♠ (no alert!) regardless of my self alert telling the opps I've got 5♠ and 4♥. Partner doubled, RHO bid 3!c. I passed, of course. LHO passed and partner doubled again. What should I bid now?

Pard RHO You LHO

1♦ Pass 2♥ 2♠

X 3♣ Pass Pass

X Pass ?

 

l was not optimistic of setting the contract so I retreated to 3♦. Partner bid 3♠. I was not sure about the meaning of this bid and finally decided that opp may psyche the 2♠ or just forgot to alert his cue bid. After some moment of agony, I finally passed. The whole auction was:

Pard RHO You LHO

1♦ Pass 2♥ 2♠

X 3♣ Pass Pass

X Pass 3♦ Pass

3♠ All pass

 

My pd has become declarer in the miserable 3♠ contract with his monster hand Q AK KQJTx KQ8xx. LHO did have 7♠ and the contract swiftly went down 3 tricks.

 

What is the worst bid of the whole auction? My correction to 3♦ or the final pass or ...?

[TylerE]

Worst Bid=2♥

 

Two suited bids with lousy suits suck.

[mike777]

2H

 

Alert convention police misuse, overuse of fine convention.

I play reverse flannery is around 8-11 or 7+-11

[inquiry]

Assuming 2♥ showed crappy hand with at least 5♠ and 4♥, you have no choice but to pass 3♣X. Can this be takeout? No you have shown your distribution and tremendously limited your hand. (I use 2♥ for very weak, 2♠ as upto invitational).

 

I don't know, but when you told your story, stick to it.. partner is the boss (captain).

[kfay]

I don't have a problem with 2♥. This seems fine to me. But Ben is right, you've shown your hand so pass the double.

[gwnn]

What Ben and The Kfay said.

[Edmunte1]

2♥ is fine, you showed your shape and strength (not inv, 5+♠+4+♥). His doubles are penality. You're not asked to join the party, he's on his own now.

Partner should have passed in 3♦ too

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

 

the answer is simple: Removing the double.

 

You said, you have the perfect hand, for the bid,

i.e. you were able to describe your hand very

narrowly to partner.

So the question is, why did you take over the

role of the captain?

The only explanation is, that you did not believe

partner, and this is far worse than anything you

can do, because your action tell partner, that he

is an idiot.

 

With kind regards

Marlowe

[benlessard]

Lets just say that 3S isnt the bid of the year !

 

After the X 3S has to be natural.

 

 

 

1- worst bid = 3S

2nd place = pulling the X

 

if your 2H show (6-9) or at least 6 pts. Then i give a 3rd place to 2H.

 

If 2H show 4 to something then 2 H is the systemic bid.

[helene_t]

P should not have made such an ambigous 3♠ bid. 3N would do. You should have passed the double unless it is specifically agreed as optional, but p's 3♠ bid was worse IMHO.

[whereagles]

Bidding was fine except that 3♠ is quite risky because there may be a misunderstanding (as there was!). I think pard shouldn't bid that. 3NT or 4♦ would be preferable.

[david_c]

I hate 2♥ - it's not just the rubbish suits that are the problem, it's the good support for partner's diamonds.

[whereagles]

That's not that big an issue playing strong NT.

[Apollo81]

The worst call was the 3♦ bid by far. You didn't promise ANY defense with the 2♥ bid, and you had an ace!

 

The 2♥ bid was also wrong because of the diamond support. I would respond 1♠ on this hand so we can play in 2♦ if partner rebids a minor.

 

The weak reverse flannery response should only be used when opener could rebid a NF 2m and you would want to bid a NF 2♥. This isn't the case here.

[Al_U_Card]

Pard opens 1♦ intending to J/S into 3♣ to GF over any response. Your response confirms his intention to get to game as well as indicating that NT or a major are out of the question because of the obvious misfit and lack of communication.

 

Once the opps get involved, he has to decide, game in a minor or try to punish the opps? Since you are white and they are red, the double seems likely, but at what level? Based on the auction, I like your bid of 3♦, as it says that you have a ♦ fragment. Once he hears this, he knows that a ♦ game is likely and he should bid it. I doubt the opps would go further. When you know what to do, just do it and take the pressure off pard.

 

btw your comment "Partner bid 3♠. I was not sure about the meaning of this bid" if not sure then it is forcing :lol:

 

So, the pass of 3♠ is the worst bid as it was ambiguous to you but I took it in the context as asking about a ♠ stopper for NT!!!! (Even though pard should now be more interested in 5♦, he is checking for the easier 9 trick game, which makes sense.

[whereagles]

5 cards is a stopper :lol:

[SoTired]

1) You have 5-8 hcp, 5s & 4h, so 2H is mandatory. All the other criticism about your 2H bid don't seem to understand the RFR convention, so they can be ignored.

2) why are we pulling penalty doubles? Seems cowardly to me. How can the double be anything but penalty. We have described our hand more accurately than a 1N opener does, so even if playing competitive dbls, partners doubles are all penalty.

3) Why did you not ask what 2S meant? Why are you guessing?

 

3D is most terrible bid of the auction

3S is 2nd

pass of 3S is 3rd

 

3S is worse than pass of 3S, because opener should realize from responder's 3D bid that responder is confused and should not trust responder to make a good decision.

[whereagles]

why are we pulling penalty doubles?

huh.. maybe because it shows a weak hand with 5431, which happens to be exactly what we have???

[jdonn]

3) Why did you not ask what 2S meant? Why are you guessing?

Because there is a <1% chance the opponents have an agreement, so you only help them by asking.

[mike777]

"1) You have 5-8 hcp, 5s & 4h, so 2H is mandatory. All the other criticism about your 2H bid don't seem to understand the RFR convention, so they can be ignored."

 

 

 

Lol...you can play whatever you want but this statement is simply wrong...very wrong. :) 2H is not mandatory and many experts do not play RFR this way.

Again if you want to play it this way, ok, but it is far from a mandatory agreement of what the convention is. In fact I think it is a poor way to play the convention but to each his own. :)

 

btw many cannot play one minor=2s as a stronger rfr raise because that is a limit raise in the bid minor.

[pclayton]

2♥ is 1000% clear. Good luck finding the 4-4 heart fit without it.

 

Sit for the double. Its a likely misfit and they've stepped in it.

[SoTired]

3) Why did you not ask what 2S meant? Why are you guessing?

Because there is a <1% chance the opponents have an agreement, so you only help them by asking.

Fair enuf, but I think I'd pay off to the opps if they have a set defense, which they forgot to alert, to RFR, a convention that even many experts have never heard of. (or are you kidding and I am taking you too seriously... i can never tell)

 

Concerning not bidding 2H:

 

Unless someone is playing a home-grown version of RFR, it was described here and other places.

 

With a weak hand (5-8 or 5-9 or 6-9) and 5s, 4h (or 5-5 or 6-4), then you respond 2H to a 1m opening. (there are a bunch of continuations). This is a conventional bid. It's like playing Flannery and opening 1H rather than 2D because "my suits were not strong enough". NO... The strength of the suits are irrelevant. If you have the range and the correct shape, you bid it. PERIOD. If you don't, then partner will assume you either don't have the applicable shape or are too strong.

 

The RFR discussion was on this forum somewhere because Fred Gitelman plays it (or used to) and either he or someone else described it here.

[han]

I would have bid 2H as well, although take away the diamond ace and I'd bid 1S. Arend and I agreed that with "less than an honest response" we typically bid 1S.

 

After 2H you have to pass the double of 3C. You have no idea what partner has and partner has quite a good picture of what you have.

 

Partner's 3S is really weird. I've never ever heard of a bid that asks if someone has a stopper in a suit they have shown 5+ cards.

[Al_U_Card]

To get pard to bid NT so that the lead comes to him.