compete

[jillybean]

Dealer: North Vul: All Scoring: IMP ♠ 8732 ♥ 85 ♦ Q5 ♣ AJT84

 

West North East South

 

 -     1♥    1♠    ?

  

 

Your bid

[Mbodell]

I'd pass. I can then bid 2♥ later if we have a slow part score battle or bid 2♣ if it is passed around to partner who reopens with a dbl or let the opponents try to play with half the points if they bid higher in spades.

[whereagles]

1NT for me.

[Guest Jlall]

Pass, you do not have to bid every time you have 7 points. This is a clearcut pass because:

 

-Your hand is very marginal for a 1N bid even if you have a stopper (I would pass if my DQ were the SQ, it's a borderline hand though). With no stopper combined with a general lack of values that bid is really going to get you to the wrong contract too often. Also, when you have no stopper, you'd rather have xx than xxxx because the more length you have the less likely partner is to be able to stop the suit.

 

-Again, you have marginal values for a negative double (I would make one if my diamonds and clubs were reversed), but here you don't have diamonds or a heart fit so partner may overcompete thinking there is a fit if he is say, 5-5 in the reds, or even 5-4 in the reds.

 

-When you have spade length it makes it likely partner will reopen (because he will have shortness). If he does not reopen, he will have spade length, and defending 1S will probably be best (since you have more spades than them usually). If partner has what you need for game you will hear more from him, so it is not critical to bid now. It is more critical to bid when you have shortness than length in their suit.

 

Whereagles, I know you like making bad bids on purpose, but you should not impose them on the beginner forum (or at least preface it by saying "this is a bad bid but I am whereagles and do stuff like this for no reason"). Would you honestly advise a beginner to bid 1N with no explanation of the bid? I think you do a terrible disservice to the beginners/intermediates of the forum when you do stuff like this, even ken rexford doesn't do this with his weird ideas.

[helene_t]

Pass, nothing else is possible. And with four trumps, I'm happy to pass. If 1♠ is passed out, opps are in the wrong partscore.

[skjaeran]

No bid. (Btw, pass isn't a bid... :rolleyes: ).

[whereagles]

Whereagles, I know you like making bad bids on purpose, but you should not impose them on the beginner forum (or at least preface it by saying "this is a bad bid but I am whereagles and do stuff like this for no reason"). Would you honestly advise a beginner to bid 1N with no explanation of the bid? I think you do a terrible disservice to the beginners/intermediates of the forum when you do stuff like this, even ken rexford doesn't do this with his weird ideas.

I'm not having you accusing me of being dishonest. Go back where you came from and learn some manners.

 

If you wanna discuss the subject seriously, be a man and apologize.

[Guest Jlall]

Whereagles, I know you like making bad bids on purpose, but you should not impose them on the beginner forum (or at least preface it by saying "this is a bad bid but I am whereagles and do stuff like this for no reason"). Would you honestly advise a beginner to bid 1N with no explanation of the bid? I think you do a terrible disservice to the beginners/intermediates of the forum when you do stuff like this, even ken rexford doesn't do this with his weird ideas.

I'm not having you accusing me of being dishonest. Go back where you came from and learn some manners.

 

If you wanna discuss the subject seriously, be a man and apologize.

lol. If I was rude I would just call you a moron, but you showed it in a way that I never would be able to :P

[whereagles]

Seems I expected too much from a stuck-up like you...

[han]

Normal pass.

[pclayton]

Pass is clear.

[jillybean]

Dealer: North Vul: All Scoring: IMP ♠ 8732 ♥ 85 ♦ Q5 ♣ AJT84

 

West North East South

 

 -     1♥    1♠    Pass

 2♦    Pass  2♠    

  

 

Still a pass?

[helene_t]

Yes, still a pass. Dbl would be penalty.

[skjaeran]

Partner couldn't act over 2♦ and opps haven't found a fit. No reason to act now.

[jillybean]

delete, wrong hand

[helene_t]

[delete, wrong hand]

[whereagles]

Dealer: North Vul: All Scoring: IMP ♠ 8732 ♥ 85 ♦ Q5 ♣ AJT84  

 

West  North East  South

 

 -     1♥    1♠    Pass

 2♦    Pass  2♠    

  

 

Still a pass?

See, had one bid 1NT before, one could now pass without a qualm.

 

As it is, it's another guess, at a much worse situation than before.

[Finch]

Dealer: North Vul: All Scoring: IMP ♠ 8732 ♥ 85 ♦ Q5 ♣ AJT84

 

West North East South

 

 -     1♥    1♠    ?

  

 

Your bid

Justin has explained why pass is right.

Just to reinforce this, here is my list of possible actions in order of preference:

 

1. Pass. Not a suitable hand to act on, looking at long spades. If you pass, the next hand passes and partner reopens with a double you have an easy 3C bid. Two of the reasons to act on the first round are i) you won't be able to describe your hand when partner reopens and ii) you have spade shortage so partner won't be able to act. Neither of these apply here.

 

If you took away all my green cards, the alternatives in my order of preference are:

 

2. Double. Not great off only qx on diamonds, but if opponents stop bidding you will get away with it. Partner might rebid 1NT, which is likely the right spot (played by partner), or 2H, or even 2C and if partner bids 2D we can give preference to 2H, sounding like a 3-2-3-5 which is not so far from our hand. I have no strong objection to double here, particularly if it were love all at matchpoints (which it isn't).

 

3. 2C. Light on values, but it's where we live and we may get away with it. Again, we can pass a 2H rebid, give preference to 2H over 2D. The only real problem is that partner might get carried away with a decent hand.

 

4. 2H. Right on values, one heart light. I don't really believe in this type of raise (particularly without a heart honour) but it's my fourth choice.

 

5. 1NT is just wrong. It has virtually no upside and totally misdescribes the hand. If we are making 3NT it is far more likely to be need to be played by partner (just imagine Kx in his hand) and he is entitled to raise 1NT to 3NT on, say, x AKQxxx Axx Kxx and we just look silly.

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

 

Pass, but it is merely a matter of partnership agreements.

 

If you require a stopper for 1NT, which is standard, you

have to pass.

If it is just a call showing some strength, say 6-10, than

1 NT is fine, but this is non standard.

 

I used to play it that way and it did work, but at this time

I was playing Acol with a weak NT and as opener we used

to show our shape, so I had some protection, if partner passed,

he was most of the time bal., meaning he did hold a strong NT

in his hand.

... and the quality of our opponents was also questionable.

 

Playing a strong NT opener, you dont have this kind of protection,

so I wont recommend it.

 

But there is one small benefit: B/I players need a long time until

they learn to reopen as opener with shortage in the opponents suit

on min. values, quite often opener passes, and you may find it easier

to find your partscore, if you bid 1 NT with the given hand in the

given sequence.

 

With kind regards

Marlowe

[P_Marlowe]

Dealer: North Vul: All Scoring: IMP ♠ 8732 ♥ 85 ♦ Q5 ♣ AJT84  

 

West  North East  South

 

 -     1♥    1♠    Pass

 2♦    Pass  2♠    

  

 

Still a pass?

Yes, you are dead.

 

But most of the time nothing terrible will have happened.

 

Partner wont have a good 6 card suit, else he would have

bid it, and he wont have add. values with 4 clubs, he could

have doubled, ... a double of 2D should still be mainly for

takeout, but who knows.

 

So most of the time, you wont have a fit, and this makes

the 3 level a terrible place to be.

 

As it is, the value of oyur hand decreased, because of the

2D bid by the opponents, pass and see what develops.

 

With kind regards

Marlowe

[cherdano]

See, had one bid 1NT before, one could now pass without a qualm.

 

As it is, it's another guess, at a much worse situation than before.

Surely you are joking Mr. eagles.

What are you worried about? If we had game, partner would have acted. We might mist a 5-4 club fit, but bidding 1N wouldn't have encouraged partner to show clubs at all.

[P_Marlowe]

See, had one bid 1NT before, one could now pass without a qualm.

 

As it is, it's another guess, at a much worse situation than before.

Surely you are joking Mr. eagles.

What are you worried about? If we had game, partner would have acted. We might mist a 5-4 club fit, but bidding 1N wouldn't have encouraged partner to show clubs at all.

Thats not 100% sure, we are in the B/I section,

so it is not clear if opener would have acted

without an encouraging signal.

 

... And that may have been his point.

 

 

With kind regards

Marlowe

[jtfanclub]

Dealer: North Vul: All Scoring: IMP ♠ 8732 ♥ 85 ♦ Q5 ♣ AJT84

 

West North East South

 

 -     1♥    1♠    ?

  

 

Your bid

This is why I love negative free bids, which makes this an easy (albeit minimum) 2♣ call.

[gwnn]

Dealer: North Vul: All Scoring: IMP ♠ 8732 ♥ 85 ♦ Q5 ♣ AJT84  

 

West  North East  South

 

-    1♥    1♠    ?

 

 

Your bid

This is why I love negative free bids, which makes this an easy (albeit minimum) 2♣ call.

pretty subminimum :)

[whereagles]

Well...... Since some EXPERTS are having trouble understanding my 1NT bid, I must agree beginners will probably have a hard time following it.

 

For clarity, here's why I bid it: I want to bid my hand as quickly I can. I think it is better to make a slight distortion and bid 1NT than to lose time passing and hoping for the best. As you've seen, later developments justified my approach.

 

Now for some comments:

 

cherdano: I'm not joking, and this isn't about a game. If pard has, say, 13-14, it's our hand and we must tell that to pard RIGHT NOW because next round might be too late (as it turned out to be). I agree bidding 1NT might have not been enough to find a club fit, but passing sure does a much better job of burying it :)

 

Frances: perhaps you loath to bid NT without stoppers. You might be right, but I totally disagree with that view because priorities in bidding aren't to show stoppers, but rather shape and strenght. 1NT is spot-on on strength and does a decent job on shape. It doesn't show a stopper because that's a requirement secondary to shape/strength.

 

As for what pard might do with x AKQxxxx Axx Kx, I say to blast 3NT is just lazy (not to mention I'd open that 2♣.. lol). This hand bids 2♠ to ask pard whether he's serious about his stop.

 

I really think the stopper requirement is a stone-age requirement :)