To support or not?

[Quantumcat]

[hv=d=n&v=n&s=s5ht942dkqjt975c6]133|100|Scoring: IMP[/hv]

 

Your partner opens 1♥ to which the opponent pre-empts 3♠. What is better, 4♥, 4♦, or pass? I don't think 5♦ is an option because partner might take it as a splinter or something.

 

I bid 4♥, because I was afraid if I bid 4♦ it would go 4♠ pass back to me, now I can't say 4♥ to tell him about my support. Or does it not matter at all because of the beautiful diamond suit?

[matmat]

4h is fine. i'd probably bid 5d/4s if that decision were to be made

[mcphee]

My thoughts are 4H is best for now. Bidding D does not let us show where we want to play. What would happen if you bid 4D and now heard 4S and partner dbled? Defensively things are not looking so good are they? We have an offensive hand with no intention of defending a S contract. At least after rasing H when the enemy bid 4S if partner were to dble you can consider 5D and feel that you have got the hand off your chest.

[paulg]

When making decisions on hands like this, I like to consider how many bids my hand is worth in the first instance.

 

In this case I would say one bid, so it is clear to support partner first.

 

Paul

[Winstonm]

I think pass is automatic. Any other bid overstates the hand.

[jdonn]

4♥ of course. The problem with 4♦ is if partner then doubles 4♠ you really don't know what to do.

 

Someone passed?!?!?!?!? AKxxx of hearts AND OUT is game!

[Winstonm]

Someone passed?!?!?!?!? AKxxx of hearts AND OUT is game!

 

In some circles this is known as discipline. :P

 

But I am pretty sure the following has never happened to the 4H bidders.

 

4H-4S-X-XX

5D-X-P-5S

P-6S--P-P

P

 

4H-4S-X-XX

5D-X-5H-X

P-P-P

[jdonn]

But I am pretty sure the following has never happened to the 4H bidders.

 

4H-4S-X-XX

5D-X-P-5S

P-6S--P-P

P

 

4H-4S-X-XX

5D-X-5H-X

P-P-P

Uh you are correct! I have never had an opponent overcall 3♠ over my partner's 1♥ bid, then later redouble when he was raised to game.

 

You take your discipline, I'll take my games.

[Winstonm]

You take your discipline, I'll take my games.

 

Your games or their games? :P

 

It is virtually a certainty what will happen over 4H: LHO will bid 4S. I have as yet to find a way to play, much less make my 4H contract when the opponents bid 4S.

 

Of course, if you play the Fast/Slow Bid System, partner will know your hand type when you bid 4H.

[mr1303]

Partners of mine tend to have their penalty doubles somewhat more than the suggested auction, which has the opponents later bidding an undoubled slam.

 

Anyway, there's no guarantee at all that LHO will bid 4S, and even less that a) it'll be the right thing to do, :P partner won't know what to do in that situation and c) we'll be better off not raising partner's suit with 4 card support, 2 singletons and an outside 1 loser suit, since partner CERTAINLY won't play us for this hand if the auction goes:

 

1H 3S P 4S

?

[jdonn]

It is virtually a certainty what will happen over 4H: LHO will bid 4S. I have as yet to find a way to play, much less make my 4H contract when the opponents bid 4S.

Partner is still there, allowed to bid 5♥. This could well be making. This could well be a good save. If we pass, he would well be blocked out of the bidding altogether when we are cold for slam (xx AKxxxx Ax Axx). You will note these are realistic scenarios, unlike the absolutely ridiculous auctions you proposed which involve

- Partner making apparently insane penalty doubles when we only raised him under pressure.

- A preemptor redoubling when he was raised to game.

- A preemptor overruling his partner's penalty double at the 5 level.

- The partner of a preemptor raising the preemptor's escape to slam, after having only signed off in game at his last turn.

On the second auction, you don't even know if the 5♥X is cold. Or a good save over their 4♠. Intelligent design is more believable than the auctions you proposed :P

[Winstonm]

The times that I can make a 40+% a minimum game, like xx, AK(J)xx, Axx, xxx, the opponents will hold a 100% chance for 4S - and lurker is bound to have his part of HCP.

[han]

I'd rather bid 5H than pass.

 

I'm bidding 4H but I will definitely act over 4S.

[pclayton]

Pass? Winston you're better than this.

 

4♥ is clear and I will bid 5♦ over 4♠. The main decision might be at the 6 level, but this call is routine.

 

Call me undisciplined.

[Winstonm]

Partner is still there, allowed to bid 5♥.

 

A little question, here. If the auction continues: 1H-3S-4H-4S-X, do you pull the double or sit?

 

If you pull, partner will hold KQ, AJxxx, xx, Axxx

If you sit, partner will hold Kx, AKxxx, Axxx, xx

 

Of course, this presupposes that a 4H bid expresses some values - if the 4H bid does not express values, you can do whatever you wish.

[han]

A little question, here. If the auction continues: 1H-3S-4H-4S-X, do you pull the double or sit?

Pull.

 

If you pull, partner will hold KQ, AJxxx, xx, Axxx

If you sit, partner will hold Kx, AKxxx, Axxx, xx

 

Do you ever win at bridge?

[pclayton]

Partner is still there, allowed to bid 5♥.

 

A little question, here. If the auction continues: 1H-3S-4H-4S-X, do you pull the double or sit?

 

If you pull, partner will hold KQ, AJxxx, xx, Axxx

If you sit, partner will hold Kx, AKxxx, Axxx, xx

 

Of course, this presupposes that a 4H bid expresses some values - if the 4H bid does not express values, you can do whatever you wish.

I pull the double. Pard has extras and we are making 5♥.

 

Sanity check - are there others that think we are in a forcing pass over 4♠? I don't.

[skjaeran]

Partner is still there, allowed to bid 5♥.

 

A little question, here. If the auction continues: 1H-3S-4H-4S-X, do you pull the double or sit?

 

If you pull, partner will hold KQ, AJxxx, xx, Axxx

If you sit, partner will hold Kx, AKxxx, Axxx, xx

 

Of course, this presupposes that a 4H bid expresses some values - if the 4H bid does not express values, you can do whatever you wish.

I pull the double. Pard has extras and we are making 5♥.

 

Sanity check - are there others that think we are in a forcing pass over 4♠? I don't.

Forcing pass after I jumped to 4♥?? - NEVER.

[han]

It's not a jump Harald, but still no forcing pass.

[cherdano]

Of course, this presupposes that a 4H bid expresses some values - if the 4H bid does not express values, you can do whatever you wish.

4♥ expresses values, namely some playing strength for hearts. It doesn't promise much of defense.

 

You can't afford to pass here with 4 trumps, two singletons, a great side suit, when both 4S and 5H might be making. If the opponents bid 4S and partner has Kx of spades, he will figure out that we may have been bidding on a shapely hand and won't assume a balanced hand with 13 hcp.

[skjaeran]

It's not a jump Harald, but still no forcing pass.

Hehe, you're absolutely right Han. B)

[Winstonm]

Dear undisciplined B) :

 

I suppose you have never had the experience of writing down -200 when the opponents were cold for 4S but didn't bid on due to your pass. When it is unclear whose hand it is in a competetive auction, it is often right to bid on a hand that might otherwise pass: Q, xxx, Axxx, Axxxx might well bid 4S over 4H but pass over pass.

[Winstonm]

Do you ever win at bridge?

 

Not by trying to guess which times partner really has hid bid or not. B)

[Winstonm]

4♥ expresses values, namely some playing strength for hearts. It doesn't promise much of defense.

 

 

That's a fine agreement and I have no problem with that - but I guess you then have to pass or double or bid 3NT with K10x, Qxxx, AJxx, Kx?

 

Or is this the slow 4H? B)

[han]

No, you bid 4H with that as well. And when the opponents bid 4S you double.