Stayman with a advance player

[PedroG]

BBO hand

 

I had 11 HCP and my partner open 1NT, I had also 4♠ so I decide to use stayman to see if we could get a 8-card major fit...

 

Well I tought I could get a negative or positive answer

 

2♦ or 2♥ / 2 ♠

 

but my partner bid 2NT, well can't understand that at the moment neither now, so I just bid a 3♣ natural hoping that my partner understand it...

 

I made the 3♣ but still don't understand the answer of 2NT to stayman.

 

Thank you all

Pedro Gil

 

PS: At the time partner asked me why I had not bid 3NT, and I told him that with a singleton I have bad feelings about a NT contract...

[goobers]

2NT does not exist playing regular Stayman. (Playing pickup, I would just assume that partner meant to bid 2D, but rest assured, opener is NOT allowed to bid 2NT here.)

 

Your best practical bid after 2N would probably just be 3N.

[SoTired]

The original stayman definition had a 2N reply, but that has not been there for, oh..., about 60-70 years.

 

There are only 3 answers to stayman: 2D = no 4-card major, 2H = 4♥ and maybe 4♠ and 2S=4♠ and <4♥

 

Oh... It is commonly accepted that after bidding stayman, then 3 of either minor is natural and game-forcing.

[kenrexford]

I have heard several explanations for 2NT. All have seemed odd. I have no idea how to guess which one partner meant (unless you see his hand).

 

Some have used 2NT as 2245/2254; some as 44 maximum; some as a weakish 6332 with a minor (3minor, instead, is a semi-solid six-bager).

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

 

depending on the version of stayman you play

2NT shows either 4-4 in the Mayors or denies

4-4 and is Min (the later is called Australian Stayman).

 

The first version implies, that you never bid Stayman

wit a weak hand and 4-4.

 

And this version gets played, but not very often.

 

With kind regards

Marlowe

[PedroG]

Hi All,

 

And first of all, many thanks for the answers, it brought a bit of enlightment :)

 

I assured that having "Novice" on my profile, would not really be playing any more or less unusual conventions ;)

 

About the bid after the 2NT, I didn't bid 3NT because of the singleton in ♥.

 

Pedro Gil

[bid_em_up]

2N does not exist (normally).

 

There is no reason to fear 3N because you have stiff heart. Partner has 15-17, you have 11, simply raise to 3N. The field will be in it, and so should you. If it goes down, thats life.

 

My partnerships use 2N as 4-4 in the majors and max NT, but it is not a "normal" bid.

[sceptic]

the europeans seem to use 2NT in stayman to show both majors

 

my mother plays in england and that is the way she was taght to play it

[Echognome]

the europeans seem to use 2NT in stayman to show both majors

 

my mother plays in england and that is the way she was taght to play it

I just want to mention that in England, stayman is *now* taught as is commonly known, where the *only* responses are 2♦, 2♥, and 2♠.

 

See, for example, the documents on the EBU website called Standard English.

[P_Marlowe]

the europeans seem to use 2NT in stayman to show both majors

 

my mother plays in england and that is the way she was taght to play it

As far as I recall, 2NT is an possible answer in the

german standard system FORUM D.

But this Stayman variant does not get played very

often, ... and as noted above, a Stayman variant with

an 2NT answer gets played in Donw Under, although

as far as I have read more by some club players.

 

With kind regards

Marlowe

[rbforster]

I vaguely recall some people who play off-shape NT's like 7222 or 6322 shapes with a long minor as showing this by responding 2NT (NF) to stayman. I haven't played this style myself, but that's what occurred to me should I be forced to interpret an undiscussed 2NT response.

[PedroG]

Hi All,

 

That was my first post at this forum, and I may say that I'm impressed :) I will use it frequentlly to help me improve in my Bridge ;)

 

Thank u all for the kind responses, and excuse me for my stiff English :D

 

I understood completly the no fear of the 3NT, I have the A♥ and partner has at minimum a doubleton at ♥, so a stopper is in place.

 

and the 26 minimum points make this a attactive 3NT.

 

Thanks

Pedro Gil

[neilkaz]

the europeans seem to use 2NT in stayman to show both majors

 

my mother plays in england and that is the way she was taght to play it

I presume she doesn't allow Garbage Staymen..ie with less than invitational values intending to pass any response (or in some varients pull 2♦ to 2M to signoff).

[Apollo81]

2NT is not a possible answer to Stayman. Most people who do that are beginners who don't know that you're supposed to bid 2♦ with no major.

[Gerben42]

As far as I recall, 2NT is an possible answer in the

german standard system FORUM D.

 

Yes but I've yet to meet a good pair in Germany playing this. It just shows (again!) that the learning system is filled with unneccessary burden of artificiality.

[barmar]

So what WAS partner's hand, Pedro? Did you ask him what he meant by 2NT?

[goobers]

There is no reason to fear 3N because you have stiff heart. Partner has 15-17, you have 11, simply raise to 3N. The field will be in it, and so should you. If it goes down, thats life.

Yeah, everyone's doing it. You want to be cool, DON'T YOU!?!?

[PedroG]

So what WAS partner's hand, Pedro?  Did you ask him what he meant by 2NT?

[hv=d=w&w=sk52hj9dkq42caq83&e=sa1074had763ck10764]266|100|Scoring: IMP[/hv]

 

Biding was

 

 

1NT - P - 2C - P

2NT - P - 3C - all pass

 

She wanted me to bid 3NT, with the 2NT bid, like I said I was a bit afraid due to my "Novice" status and the ♥ singleton

 

And to be honest my 3♣ bid was a SOS, I didn't known what to do I was expecting staymen response, was prepared for that, and nothing else :)

 

Paper with the notes flying around in a hope that in those few seconds you have to bid I could find a answer :P

 

ty

Pedro Gil

[barmar]

Did she explain why she bid 2NT rather than the normal 2♦? I don't think her hand falls into any of the systemic 2NT responses that have been mentioned in the thread.

 

BTW, it looks to me like 3NT goes down on a ♥ lead. 5♣ looks to be about 50%.

[kenrexford]

Did she explain why she bid 2NT rather than the normal 2♦? I don't think her hand falls into any of the systemic 2NT responses that have been mentioned in the thread.

 

BTW, it looks to me like 3NT goes down on a ♥ lead. 5♣ looks to be about 50%.

Spade-Heart-Diamond squeeze?

 

Maybe one person has ♠QJx ♥KQxxx ♦Ax ♣xxx, or something like that?

 

An excellent game!

[PedroG]

Did she explain why she bid 2NT rather than the normal 2♦?  I don't think her hand falls into any of the systemic 2NT responses that have been mentioned in the thread.

 

BTW, it looks to me like 3NT goes down on a ♥ lead.  5♣ looks to be about 50%.

Hi,

 

Not the chance of doing it, if u "Novice" and playing with all "Advance" players I tend to assume that it's me that don't known what I'm doing :blink:

 

And review hands later, and try to understand what went good/bad...

 

At the time I assumed that she was correct, and didn't question any futher.

 

Well must of the pairs that played that hand end up on 3NT and went down 1.

 

16 pairs that have played

 

ty

Pedro

[goobers]

General word of caution Pedro: Listen when other players offer advice, but do not accept it for truth until you have verified it.

 

Everyone's an expert on BBO.

[PedroG]

General word of caution Pedro: Listen when other players offer advice, but do not accept it for truth until you have verified it.

 

Everyone's an expert on BBO.

Hi,

 

;)

 

I understand what you are saying to me :(

 

at the moment, I prefer the attitude that everything said is need to read and taken nore and study, and learn tool... Then I will try to see what went wrong and what I did right...

 

But I will try to keep your advice in the back of my ear :blink:

 

ty

Pedro Gil

[skjaeran]

the europeans seem to use 2NT in stayman to show both majors

 

my mother plays in england and that is the way she was taght to play it

Some Europeans maybe. I know some teached like that in Norway too, but that's a long time ago.

[barmar]

BTW, just because it goes down, doesn't mean it's the wrong bid. Notice that 3NT is the most common contract on the traveler. There are lots of hands she could have had where 3NT would be the right contract. And notice that 2 pairs actually did make it (one with overtricks!).