How high?

[Free]

RHO opens 1♦ in first seat. You hold:

[hv=d=e&v=n&s=skhdk654cjt876532]133|100|Scoring: IMP[/hv]

What's your plan?

[helene_t]

Once in a lifetime I seriously consider passing with an 8-card. Can't achive anything at this vulnerability, don want a club lead, can't keep opps from finding their 10-card major suit fit, and don't want to keep them out of their 8-card fit. Also I have no idea what to do if partner bids 3N after my 3♣.

 

I voted 3♣ which I would do at the table. Then at least partner will shut up with his 7-card major (or 5-5 majors) which might take us too high if I pass. But I wonder if pass is the percentage bid.

[gwnn]

What Helene said

[whereagles]

This is a trap. Pard is short on clubs and diamonds and thus rates to have a major 55 or 65. Any bidding should be made by opps, who will end up quite disappointed at the play of the ♥A :P

[Fluffy]

3♣, much better contract than 4M for sure

[Apollo81]

3♣. I'll venture that no one would actually pass with this at the table and that anyone who suggests this is doing this because this is an opinion post.

[pbleighton]

3♣. I'll venture that no one would actually pass with this at the table and that anyone who suggests this is doing this because this is an opinion post.

 

Agree.

 

Peter

[jdonn]

I pass, one of two things will be the case. The opponents have game values and are bidding game regardless of what I do, in which case I want all these bad breaks to remain a surprise. Or partner has a good hand and will bid a major over 3♣ if I bid it, which just thrills me to death. I really think pass is clear, any time we don't have a big club fit I'm sure it's right.

 

I would absolutely pass at the table.

[whereagles]

any time we don't have a big club fit I'm sure it's right.

Actually, a "big club fit" requires pard to have 3-4 clubs. Most would probably agree that is not really the expectation value for pard's nr. of clubs :rolleyes:

[skjaeran]

I pass, one of two things will be the case. The opponents have game values and are bidding game regardless of what I do, in which case I want all these bad breaks to remain a surprise. Or partner has a good hand and will bid a major over 3♣ if I bid it, which just thrills me to death. I really think pass is clear, any time we don't have a big club fit I'm sure it's right.

 

I would absolutely pass at the table.

I can't say I'd absolutely pass at the table. But agree with Josh that it's the best call.

[Guest Jlall]

I would absolutely bid 3C and agree with myself that its the best call ;)

 

It seems silly to say "by preempting we will alert them to bad splits," all preempts do this so do you guys just never preempt? We mess up their auction, make constructive bidding harder for them, enable partner to further the preempt with a nice fit, etc etc. In doing this we give them some information. That is preempting, and I would have thought by now we have established that the gains outweigh the costs.

[pclayton]

I pass, one of two things will be the case. The opponents have game values and are bidding game regardless of what I do, in which case I want all these bad breaks to remain a surprise. Or partner has a good hand and will bid a major over 3♣ if I bid it, which just thrills me to death. I really think pass is clear, any time we don't have a big club fit I'm sure it's right.

 

I would absolutely pass at the table.

 

3♣ looks obvious to me.

 

Why would pard get excited over 3♣ holding a major? 3♣ should slow him down if anything.

 

Just because this isn't our hand doesn't mean we can't hog a few levels of bidding.

 

I'm not worried about giving away information here. It seems more likely I'll score my stiff ♠K, and we may give declarer a losing option in diamonds if the suit is AQJTxx opp a stiff in dummy. I will readily admit that partner's heart cards might as well be laying on the table, however.

[jdonn]

It seems silly to say "by preempting we will alert them to bad splits," all preempts do this so do you guys just never preempt?

I see two differences with this hand. One is that we can see here every suit for them is splitting very badly. If we were a more normal shape like 2317 over 1♦ we wouldn't really think any suit is splitting badly so preempting would have a lot less to lose in that sense.

 

The other is that I have the lowest suit, and 8 of them so partner won't often be raising, therefore I think the chances of me buying the contract in the end is very low. Even if other preempts might alert them to bad splits, at least then you might buy the contract so it won't matter anyway.

 

I still think it's unlikely to work well (or at least to be necessary) unless partner is raising. But I'll say one thing, if I pass and the auction goes something like 1♦ P 1♥ 1♠ 2♥ and I bid 3♣ now and partner assumes that means I have a spade fit, I think I'll shoot myself.

[helene_t]

if I pass and the auction goes something like 1♦ P 1♥ 1♠ 2♥ and I bid 3♣ now and partner assumes that means I have a spade fit, I think I'll shoot myself.

Yes, that's what a delayed 3♣ means so if you pass now you must keep passing (except if partner makes a t/o double of a non-club suit, which is not very likely of course).

[jdonn]

Yes, that's what a delayed 3♣ means

Ok I have only myself to blame for even mentioning it.

[mr1303]

I would pass this without a shadow of doubt. This hand is a pile of something not very pleasant, and pre-empting on just invites a telephone number

[sheepman]

I vote for 1NT, what else?

[P_Marlowe]

What Helene said

yes, I wont pass with an 8 card suit,

I will have to learn it the hard way

 

With kind regards

Marlowe

 

PS: If partner bid 3NT, I bid 4C

[the hog]

What Helene said

yes, I wont pass with an 8 card suit,

I will have to learn it the hard way

 

With kind regards

Marlowe

 

PS: If partner bid 3NT, I bid 4C

I can live with the 3H bid. What I cannot live with is pulling 3NT to 4C. This is such an abrogation of partnership discipline that I am surprised to see you write this. Normally you make sensible posts. You have NO IDEA whay pd bid 3NT. How can you possibly override that decision?

[P_Marlowe]

What Helene said

yes, I wont pass with an 8 card suit,

I will have to learn it the hard way

 

With kind regards

Marlowe

 

PS: If partner bid 3NT, I bid 4C

I can live with the 3H bid. What I cannot live with is pulling 3NT to 4C. This is such an abrogation of partnership discipline that I am surprised to see you write this. Normally you make sensible posts. You have NO IDEA whay pd bid 3NT. How can you possibly override that decision?

Thanks for the kind remark.

 

I have trust in my partner, ... and the trust

may increase after they kill me, ... the only

reason I can give you is, that sometimes I

have to learn it the hard way.

 

With kind regards

Marlowe

 

PS: I just saw, that I did write it in my

earlier post.

[Fluffy]

I can live with the 3H bid. What I cannot live with is pulling 3NT to 4C. This is such an abrogation of partnership discipline that I am surprised to see you write this

Its hard to say because it doesn't happen kinda often, how many times have you bid 3NT after partner preempts based on your own tricks, and not partners?

 

 

I've seen that a couple of times, but that's all, 95% of the time partner think you have a souce of tricks.

 

I pulled once 3NT with Qxxxxxxx and it worked out quite well.

[SoTired]

I bid 3C, but I won't pull partner's 3N. If partner has, say, ♣Ax expecting to run my club suit, I have 2 outside kings which might provide an entry. Otherwise, I have 2 outside kings to help partner with.

[pclayton]

I bid 3C, but I won't pull partner's 3N. If partner has, say, ♣Ax expecting to run my club suit, I have 2 outside kings which might provide an entry. Otherwise, I have 2 outside kings to help partner with.

Agree with this. Its very possible this suit may run with a little length in pard's hand. No reason to pull 3N.