Any comments to the following auction?

[jahol]

The deal is:

 

[hv=d=w&v=b&n=saq6hj1098dq8ckj74&w=s984h732dj974cq82&e=sj3haq654dak632c9&s=sk10752hkd105ca10653]399|300|Scoring: IMP[/hv]

 

the auction was

 

North-------East-------South-------West

.................................................pass

..1C--------2C(1)-----DBL(2)-------2S(3)

..pass------3D---------pass....

 

(1) - 5-5, diamonds+major

(2) - points

(3) - not alerted, psycho (??)

 

Yes, I think that south bid is not good, I would prefer 2 spades (non-forcing). But is the E-W bidding OK?

[mgoetze]

I think ambiguous 2-suiter overcalls suck. :P Perhaps West thought that 2NT would be the way to show ♦+♥ here, and this 2♣ automatically shows ♦+♠. Or maybe he thought they were playing Ghestem, in which case it shows ♦+♠ in any case. Either way, he probably thought N/S were very strong, and thus 2♦ is not preemptive enough.

 

And yes, 110% of the blame goes to South. :)

[firmit]

1) 2C usually shows 5-5 both major - that might explain W's 2S. 2NT would be perfect - showing the two lowest unbid.

2) Don't understand South's DBL - if not part of a defence against opps two-suiter-bid I don't know about.

3) If he thinks 5-5 major... he thinks they might compete given the two-suited fit, maybe?

[jtfanclub]

Doesn't seem that strange to me. West plans to end in diamonds in any case. In the unlikely event that he's picked the wrong suit AND the opponents don't double, down 6 probably isn't a bad result- full opener across 'points', he has to think his partner is nowhere near as strong as it turned out.

 

I suppose, techincally, it's a psyche, the same way that

 

3♦ P 3NT

 

would be a Psyche with the West hand. But making an interference bid intending to run when doubled in order to confuse the opponents seems pretty normal to me.

 

Having said that, I'm sure it was a mistake by West. But if it was for real, I applaud him for it. :lol:

[jahol]

Two more comments:

 

1) West is excellent player, one of the best in our country, very experienced. That was NOT mistake, I am sure.

 

2) I do like west bid, but I am not quite sure about EAST.

 

There was double from the left. I would expect that partner looking for my suit will simply pass and wait for my bid. With regular opening from the right and points from the left (shown with double), it is clear that partner is weak. Seems to me that having doubleton spade, believing in natural character of my partner bid (I did not alert!) I do not have any reason to look for some other suit ... at least as long as I am not doubled.

[hotShot]

East has shown ♦ and a major. If this major is not specified, bidding 2♠ should show support for both majors and from the context it's obvious that west is weak. So it's some sort of "pass or correct" used in an preemptive way.

Since partner promised a 5 card major showing 3 card support is not a psyche, unless there is an agreement that 2♠ is strong. But after north opening and south dbl showing strength, NS can hardly claim any damage.

[hrothgar]

2♠ is a perfectly reasonable bid...

 

If partner has Spades, you get to play at the 2 level

If partner doesn't have Spades, he'll declare 3♦

 

Either way, you've shut out the ability of the opponents to show Hearts at the two level. You may very well have shut out the Spade suit as well...

 

Oh yeah, 2♠ doesn't require support for both majors.

[inquiry]

2♠ by WEST is a pass/correct kind of thing. If his partner has spades and diamonds, the plays 2♠ possibly, if his partner has hearts and diamonds, he gets to have his partner play 3♦ if NS doesn't compete. It should have been alerted as PASS/CORRECT I guess, but bidding a 3 card suit opposite one of the type bids is entirely normal....

 

Last night I held S-x H-QJX D-Qxx C-KTxxxx and heard 1D on my left, 2D by partner (this time H+S), next hand doubled and I JUMPED to 3H (as much as I wanted to bid).

 

I admit there was a little CRAFT logic in bidding 2S. Surely NS have a fit in one of the other of the majors. A 2S bid makes it hard to find SPADES if no agreement exist, and has the safety of being able to run to diamonds if spades are wrong.

 

After partners DBL of 2C showing points, he got what he deserved I guess. The logical bid is 2S over 2C. I have metaagreements. Over 2C wthi this explanation, 2D would be general force, 2H would be hearts OR A HEART STOPPER and forcing, and 2S would be spades and not forcing with club support (If I had spades and no club support and a non-forcing hand, I would take the timid way out initially and pass 2C or double to suggest possible defensive hand). Over the 2H bid, opener bids 2S with heart support, and 2NT without heart support and with spades controlled.

 

Anyway, it is souths dbl and not WEST 2S bid that was the problem here. Although 2S needs to be alerted as PASS/CORRECT.

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

 

I would say EW have a misunderstanding,

East alerted, and West thought 2C showed

spades and +?

As East showed his "2nd" suit West had no

interest in correcting, and he also is not

strong enough to take another move.

 

So I would say, the bidding is ok, although

unlucky for North/South.

 

With kind regards

Marlowe

 

PS: I am pretty sure, that none sane wants

to force to the 3 level, being red, holding the

west hand: a 4-3-3-3 garbage with 3HCP.

You heard the oppoenets double, and they may

not try to kill you at the 2level, but at the 3level

the danger is real.

[hrothgar]

PS: I am pretty sure, that none sane wants

to force to the 3 level, being red, holding the

west hand: a 4-3-3-3 garbage with 3HCP.

You heard the oppoenets double, and they may

not try to kill you at the 2level, but at the 3level

the danger is real.

Guess I'm not sane:

 

We have a double fit in Diamonds and one of the majors. More importantly, the opponents also rate to have a double fit in Clubs and the other major.

 

1. 2♠ places the opponents under a lot of pressure. They can't clarify their suits without going to the three level. They aren't going to have an easy time sorting out range

 

2. Half the time partner has Spades...

 

I think this outweighes the negatives associated with a 4-3-3-3 and the lack of any controls.

[glen]

A whole bunch of times one doesn't ask questions about an auction until it is over. This is not one of those times.

 

the auction was

 

North-------East-------South-------West

.................................................pass

..1C--------2C(1)-----DBL(2)-------2S(3)

..pass------3D---------pass.... 

 

(1) - 5-5, diamonds+major

(2) - points

(3) - not alerted, psycho (??)

 

...But is the E-W bidding OK?

To answer "is the E-W bidding OK" one would have to know their agreements.

 

Also for South to make an informed call over 3♦, s/he needs to know the EW agreements. So regardless of whether 2♠ or 3♦ were alerted or not, on this strange auction, South should ask about 3♦ first, and then 2♠, and finally make a call. Besides just knowing what is going on, since you would ask about the auction on many hands that would double 2♣, you should ask here just so partner has no unauthorized information from the double-then-quietly-pass sequence.

 

If you ask "is the E-W alerting OK" (as opposed to the bidding), my answer would be no.