DBL then bid suit? 16+

[kgr]

I play that DBL then bid new suit is 16+HCP and a 5-card. We will almost never overcall wtih 16 or more points.

e.g:

1C-(DBL)-P-(1H)

p-(1S)

or

1H-(DBL)-P-(2C)

p-(2S)

 

Is that rather American, Italian, European.... style?

[cherdano]

Old-fashioned style :P

[pbleighton]

It depends on the level, and of your minimum requirements for an overcall.

 

In the U.S., it is pretty common for pairs to overcall with a decent 8 count, or even less. In that case, it doesn't make much sense (to me, anyway) to overcall with a decent 16 count, and many pairs top off their 1 level overcalls with a decent but not too good 15 count. Pairs with higher minimums tend to have higher maximums.

 

On the other hand, most pairs will have at least 12 (maybe a little less with a 6 card suit) for a 2 level overcall. In that case, the upper level for overcalls will be 17 or so.

 

Peter

[gwnn]

Your first example is not a 16+ hand in about 99% of today's players' methods. Your second one looks more standard.

 

Of course there are hands that have 16-17 hcp and need to start with an X and others that can be started out with a simple overcall with 18 hcp. Points are not everything.

[Guest Jlall]

I will overcall some 5 counts and some 19 counts. In general with most 18s I would X and most 17s I would overcall. I would hate to play a method that makes me X with 16+, the hand just isn't strong enough to control the auction.

[Free]

It's old school, LOL-style.

 

These days people intervene a lot more, so your 2 examples may be easy to handle, but what if opps bid to the 3-level? 1♣-Dbl-3♣-? and 1♥-Dbl-3♥-? Your partner will expect a takeout double, not a one-suiter (if you can even call a 5 card suit one-suited), so he might become competitive. Simple example: 1♥-Dbl-3♥-... your partner holds a singleton ♥, 4♠ and around 10HCP. It's a rather easy 4♠ bid, but now you (as doubler) have to bid 5m to show a hand with 5+m. Will you pass 4♠ with a 3 card ♠? What with a 2 card? I mean, you're screwed bigtime because in 4♠ you'll lose control of the hand if opps play ♥, and otherwise you're just in the wrong contract!

[MFA]

As Free says, it could easily become uncomfortable, if you have the 16+any hand and the bidding gets crowded.

 

I much prefer the style where you really strive to make an overcall instead and then try to catch up with strength later.

[helene_t]

Basically agree with Justin. But for me, there is an overlap between the double-the-bid-again range and the overcall range. With an average 17-20 I might choose to dbl or to overcall, depending on the flexibility of the hand. I would almost never dbl with a singleton in an unbid major. Sometimes a slightly off-shape U2NT can be an option with strong awkard hands.

[Fluffy]

16+ is what old people, and scattered players (from small cities where there ain't anyone good who teaches) play.

 

with 16-19(20) it is better to overcall 1, and then double, lets you play safer contracts.