Walddk Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 [hv=d=n&v=b&s=sa5h865dkj52cak32]133|100|Scoring: IMP[/hv]Team match on BBO yesterday. Your partner passes and RHO opens a natural 1♣. Do you overcall 1NT or not? Roland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
helene_t Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 Nope, too little trick potential. I would not overcall with this hand under any circumstances. Yet the fact that RHO opened 1♣ (unlikely to be raised preemptively) and that partner is a passed hand (making it even less likely that it's our board) makes it even less attractive to overcall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Echognome Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 I do. I don't view it subminimum for the call and it will save me headaches on any balancing decision. There is, of course, a risk of being doubled, but there's always that risk when overcalling 1NT. On the plus side, partner can effectively compete the partscore and we may have a game on (partner can still have a balanced 11 or 12 count depending on your style). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerben42 Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 Pass for me. A natural 1NT overcall starts at a GOOD 15, no middle cards here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fluffy Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 I'd like to say no, but I always do it even when I know it is wrong 1♦ seems the best bid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mhais Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 ;) bid 1nt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edmunte1 Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 Too weak for 1NT, but could work as a preempt for their major part score. I don't have intermediattes at all, almost only controls. I will bid 1♦ tghough, encouraging partener to open the bidding. I won't like to bid after 1♣-1♥-1NT for example Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike777 Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 Yes I have 4 clubs but I double, takeout.Second choice is 1D overcall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walddk Posted February 28, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 Yes I have 4 clubs but I double, takeout. What are you going to do when you get the likely 1♠ response? Roland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike777 Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 Yes I have 4 clubs but I double, takeout. What are you going to do when you get the likely 1♠ response? Roland pass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codo Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 1 NT as a preempt is fine for me. We have a lot of run out possibilities if we need them. The biggest downside is not the possible -500. I would hate more to make declarer play so easy f they are in a border line game. But all these downsides do not make up for the preempt factor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pbleighton Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 1NT. Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jlall Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 sick, no. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inquiry Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 It is bad results overcalling 1NT on hands like this that got me to switch to raptor. I have been able to bid most 1NT overcall hands adequately without using a natural 1NT overcall with Raptor. MAybe if I learn just to make a "sick" pass with these hands while playing strong NT overcalls, I would have better results overcalling 1NT. I think in the long run, pass with the hand is better. Give me the KJ9x of diamonds, I would possibly overcall 1♦. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
helene_t Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 It is bad results overcalling 1NT on hands like this that got me to switch to raptor. I have been able to bid most 1NT overcall hands adequately without using a natural 1NT overcall with Raptor. MAybe if I learn just to make a "sick" pass with these hands while playing strong NT overcalls, I would have better results overcalling 1NT. I play Raptor for the same reason, and it never occured to me to overcall a natural 1NT with this hand, allthough I would probably do it with a jack more, especially nonvul at matchpoints. Then again, make ♦J the queen and I would be equally happy to overcall 1♦. I would play a natural 1NT overcall if playing against you, though :) A friend of mine (Rosalind Hengeveld) plays a 17-20 1NT overcall - the consequence of that is that double followed by 1NT over partner's 1♠ would show 14-16. This is a good hand for her method. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MickyB Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 Eugh eugh eugh I wouldn't be close to bidding 1NT even if partner wasn't a passed hand. As it is, the main plus side of bidding 1NT (reaching game when pard has a decent hand) has gone. Easy pass. Btw, if there had been two passes to RHO I wouldn't mind 1NT. This is partly because I'd expect partner to open more conservatively in second than in first, but mainly because LHO is much less likely to find a double opposite a potentially light third seat opening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdonn Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 Obvious pass, anyone who bids 1NT is1) not considering the situation closely enough (terrible vul for that action, partner passed hand, no spot cards at all)and/or2) equating their 1NT overcall range to their 1NT opening bid range too literally.It doesn't have to be -500 to be a disaster. -200 when they were probably going down in something is lose 7, even worse than not bidding a nonvul game! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cherdano Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 Was it 800 or 1100, Roland? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeh Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 I'm going to jump on the 'pass' bandwagon for the reasons stated above, but I am not so sanguine that pass is wonderful. It is easy to see how we could be getting blocked out on this hand: we could easily miss a valuable double partscore swing or even a game. However, the odds favour the opps having the substantial majority of the highcards. I recall a hand like this many years ago. We were playing a pair, who finished (I think) 2nd and 8th in the masterpoint race in NA, in a short team match. One of them made a dubious vulnerable overcall of our 10-12 notrump and went 1700 red v white. The next hand, I made a 1N overcall on a hand very similar to this and went -1400. We won the match by 3 imps, so the moral of the story is that you overcall these hands only after picking up 1700 on the previous board. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikegill Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 No, seems clear. Switch clubs/diamonds, make me white, or make pard not a PH and we'll talk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fred Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 I think this is a lot closer than most of the others posters seem to think. If my partner was not a passed hand I would probably overcall 1NT. If I had a single nice spot card (the 10 of clubs or diamonds for example) I would probably overcall 1NT. If I was playing matchpoints I would probably overcall 1NT. If I was not vul I would probably overcall 1NT. (Not that I would be thrilled with my choice in any of these cases). I might even overcall 1NT in the actual circumstances (playing against weak opponents or opponents who open very light for example). However, I suspect I would manage to find the discipline to Pass. With my regular partners I play 1NT=15 to 18 (versus the usual 15+ to 18 that most Americans write on their convention cards). Also we are not light openers and the lighter you open the less attractive 1NT facing a passed hand becomes. For me 1D is a distant third choice (and that would remain true even if I had better spots in diamonds). This is not the type of hand that is suitable for an overcall on a 4-card suit in my view. I have never played a style in which DBL is an acceptable alternative with this sort of hand, but it would not surprise me to learn that such a style can be effective (with plenty of discussion). However, this is not even close to being "Standard" (at least in this part of the world) so it is not the sort of thing I would ever try without previous discussion. Fred GitelmanBridge Base Inc.www.bridgebase.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jtfanclub Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 [hv=d=n&v=b&s=sa5h865dkj52cak32]133|100|Scoring: IMP[/hv]Team match on BBO yesterday. Your partner passes and RHO opens a natural 1♣. Do you overcall 1NT or not? Roland Well I bid 1NT, of course. I don't understand X. If 1NT X running to 2♠ is 1400, then 1♣ XX running to 1♠ is 1100. That's not going to be a big difference in IMPs. And there's no guarantee that your partner will bid just one. Lying isn't going to save you much. Pass seems like a reasonable action. If I go for 500, surely they have 620. I might go for more, but I think it's far more likely that either my interference will keep them from finding their best score or allow partner to find a good defensive bid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cherdano Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 Fred, would you overcall 1N if you switch the minors? You seem to overcall 1N quite a bit lighter than most experts (although I guess a few world class players are quite close to your style), I remember some hands that seemed more like a 14+ than 15. Have you ever tried to keep track of your results on these overcalls? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jlall Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 Fred if even you won't bid 1N it can't be that close :P (kidding, but from what I have read and seen Fred bids 1N a lot). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walddk Posted February 28, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 To Fred: LHO did open light, and yet ... To Arend: 1100 should have been the result. For some reason only known to himself declarer elected to concede 1400. Here is the full hand: [hv=d=n&v=b&n=s843hk1042d987c875&w=skqj76h73daq1063c6&e=s1092haqj9d4cqj1094&s=sa5h865dkj52cak32]399|300|Scoring: IMP[/hv] At the other table East did not open and EW got to 4♠ making after South had opened 1NT. Roland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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