helene_t Posted February 23, 2007 Report Share Posted February 23, 2007 In Moscito 2000, 1♥ was natural while 1♦ promised spades. In Moscito 2006, 1♦ promises hearts and 1♥ promises spades. I like the natural 1♥ opening which responder can pass with a weak hand being assured of at least 4 trumps by opener. Also, the natuiral 1♥ opening is inherently more difficult to defend than a transfer opening, although when playing against gozillas you may enjoy opps getting hung by their lack of agreements against the transfer openings. I also like the two-under transfer ♦-♠. With a weak hand with no diamond length but a little , responder can bid 1♠, while the relay is 1♥. And finally, I like the idea of allocating a more economic opening to spades than to hearts so that you can show spades first with 5-5 majors, for the same reason as why natural bidders open 1♠ with 5-5. The only advantage of the 2005 approach, as far as I can see, is that you conceal declarer's hand when the auction starts 1♦-(pass/double)-1♥ and play in hearts. But with spades this is barely an issue since in the 2000 approach you could play 1♦-1♥1♠*as denying extra spade length. I have no strong opinion about the importance of this issue but since the rest of the system isn't excatly geared towards cocealing declarer's hand (opener's answer to the first relay is usually natural, as are the 1NT and 2♣ openings) it doesn't seem to be reason enough why the developers would sacrifice all the advantages of the 2000 approach. Did I miss something important? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Posted February 23, 2007 Report Share Posted February 23, 2007 After an opening with ♥, partner wants to bid ♠ natural. However, if you open 1♥, either your relay goes up, or ♠ are lost. When opening 1♦, 1♦-1♠ can be bid natural, 1♥ relay. The 2007 approach is more and more natural. Only the opening bids are in transfer, rebids are natural. Responses from 1NT to 2M are also in transfer to be able to show various types of hands. If you keep 1♥ natural, it just doesn't fit in the system anymore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Echognome Posted February 23, 2007 Report Share Posted February 23, 2007 Here are my views: Transfer openings combined with relay work very well. 1 - The relay asker begins the relay by bidding opener's 4+ card major. Since this is initially the most likely strain for the final contract, relay asker's hand will be hidden for the defense more often. 2 - Over a natural 1♥ opening, you want to be able to bid a hand that has spades and is less than GF, a hand without spades that is less than GF, and you want to be able to relay. You cannot make all 3 bids at the 1-level. With a 1♦ opening you can. (Note over a 1♥ opening showing spades or a 1♠ opening showing spades you can't do it all either.) The alternative of making 2♣ the relay is flawed because you are resolving your shapes too high to be useful. 3 - With 5-4 or 5-5 in the majors, you should have a choice within your partnership on which hands you will open 1♦ (showing hearts) or 1♥ (showing spades). I have played both that 1♦ is any unbalanced hand with 4+♥ (so even canape with spades) and where we do not canape at all. This is a style question really. There is no problem in terms of being able to show all of the shapes since the relay is quite low. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
helene_t Posted February 23, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 23, 2007 I see. Thanks. In Moscito 2000, a 1NT opening showed both majors, so presumably a 1♥ opening denied spades. Then there was less need for responder to show spades. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MickyB Posted February 23, 2007 Report Share Posted February 23, 2007 2 - Over a natural 1♥ opening, you want to be able to bid a hand that has spades and is less than GF, a hand without spades that is less than GF, and you want to be able to relay. You cannot make all 3 bids at the 1-level. With a 1♦ opening you can. (Note over a 1♥ opening showing spades or a 1♠ opening showing spades you can't do it all either.) Indeed. As long as the opening denies 4 cards in the other major, you can use step one and step two as weak and strong bids, with a 2 level bid showing 5 cards in the other major - not that I'm saying that this is optimal when the opening is natural. 3 - With 5-4 or 5-5 in the majors, you should have a choice within your partnership on which hands you will open 1♦ (showing hearts) or 1♥ (showing spades). I have played both that 1♦ is any unbalanced hand with 4+♥ (so even canape with spades) and where we do not canape at all. This is a style question really. There is no problem in terms of being able to show all of the shapes since the relay is quite low. You don't always get to relay. In many competitive auctions, you will wish you had shown spades first so that you can follow-up with a heart rebid. How do you bid to a spade part-score, 1♦:1NT, 2♠: Pass? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilun Posted February 23, 2007 Report Share Posted February 23, 2007 Here are my views: Transfer openings combined with relay work very well. 1 - The relay asker begins the relay by bidding opener's 4+ card major. Since this is initially the most likely strain for the final contract, relay asker's hand will be hidden for the defense more often. 2 - Over a natural 1♥ opening, you want to be able to bid a hand that has spades and is less than GF, a hand without spades that is less than GF, and you want to be able to relay. You cannot make all 3 bids at the 1-level. With a 1♦ opening you can. (Note over a 1♥ opening showing spades or a 1♠ opening showing spades you can't do it all either.) The alternative of making 2♣ the relay is flawed because you are resolving your shapes too high to be useful. 3 - With 5-4 or 5-5 in the majors, you should have a choice within your partnership on which hands you will open 1♦ (showing hearts) or 1♥ (showing spades). I have played both that 1♦ is any unbalanced hand with 4+♥ (so even canape with spades) and where we do not canape at all. This is a style question really. There is no problem in terms of being able to show all of the shapes since the relay is quite low.We have played 1♦ = spades & 1♥ = hearts for a decade in major national comps in Australia & see no reason to change. Transfers have plusses and minuses. The main problem comes with simple raises. The raise to 2♥/2♠ is the heart of the system -- 3 or 4 trumps & 7-10 TP. We don't want to contaminate these raises with hands that would rather rest at the 1-level. With ♠xxx ♥Axx ♦xx ♣Jxxxx we don't want to raise to 2♥/♠ but 1NT & passing a transfer opening are worse.With our method, we could pass our natural 1♥. Over 1♦ = spades, we use 1♠ as strong shape relay & 1♥ as a range probe, with 1♠ by opener as any minimum. Would work well here. in Scamp, the opening structure is1♣ 16+ (still prefer this to 15+)1♦ 10-15, 4+ spades, denies 4 hearts1♥ 11-15 4+ hearts, denies 4 spades1♠ majors1NT 12-15 balanced, no major2♣/♦ natural, no major, 10-14 The denied major helps responder a lot.1♥ - 1NT can have 4 or 5 spades, which is okayGood to have a bid set aside for both majors, vital hands.Right-siding 4♥/♠ is a plus for transfers but don't overstate it. Often the 2 hands will be similar strength and you still gain from the opening leader not knowing the relayer's hand. Nick Hughes, Sydney Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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