difficult rebid

[karlson]

[hv=d=s&v=n&s=saxhkxxxxxdaxxxca]133|100|Scoring: MP[/hv]

 

You open 1♥, partner bids a semi-forcing 1N (can't have a 3-card limit raise), and righty comes in with 2s. Pretty normal 2/1 style, double is takeout. No particular agreements about continuations, do tell if you have useful ones.

[mike777]

3d geez I can have so much less and ya i got piss poor h spots

[the hog]

Pass, don't like it but pd appears to have a fistfull of C

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

 

3D seems normal, pass being the alternative,

if you double, you will hear 3C and you wont

like it.

 

You can play 2NT in this seq. as artificial

to differentiate between a min/mediocrite

opener and a mediocrite/good opener.

 

With kind regards

Marlowe

[gwnn]

Good-bad 2NT would work nicely here... Albeit I can only show a 5-4. In either case, I should be OK cause this doesn't look like a 6-4, more like a yuck-yuck.

[Free]

Pass...

[mike777]

Good-bad 2NT would work nicely here... Albeit I can only show a 5-4. In either case, I should be OK cause this doesn't look like a 6-4, more like a yuck-yuck.

hmm not sure 2nt in good/bad 2nt is best....as usual what does my one bid show?

[mike777]

Pass...

ok I cannot pass.......even in roth stone or junky one bids

[mhais]

:) bid 2h showing 6 cards h & better hand

[the hog]

:) bid 2h showing 6 cards h & better hand

"Director! Insufficient bid"

[whereagles]

I have way more than a min, so I have to bid. I'm going in with dbl, followed by 3♦. Pard should get the message.. i hope! :)

[Echognome]

I'm passing.

[inquiry]

Pass.. with thos "x's" in hearts and diamonds.

[pbleighton]

Pass. For me, 3D shows either a fifth diamond or more points.

 

Peter

[Edmunte1]

Tough position. Let's see our choices, considering we are playing 2NT G/B:

 

1)2NT, followed by 3♦ should show 5-5 and 12-14 hcp

2)2NT, followed by 3♥ should show 6+ good ♥ and 12-14 hcp

3) a direct 3♦ should show 5-5 and 15-17 hcp

4) a direct 3♥ should show 6+ good ♥ and 15-17 hcp

5) dbl showing support for all the unbid suits or very strong hands (18+)

6)pas and waiting for partner to reopen, if he has some playing strength

 

I see only 2 possible choices 6) and 2), my choice is 6)

[jtfanclub]

Tough position. Let's see our choices, considering we are playing 2NT G/B:

 

1)2NT, followed by 3♦ should show 5-5 and 12-14 hcp

2)2NT, followed by 3♥ should show 6+ good ♥ and 12-14 hcp

3) a direct 3♦ should show 5-5 and 15-17 hcp

4) a direct 3♥ should show 6+ good ♥ and 15-17 hcp

5) dbl showing support for all the unbid suits or very strong hands (18+)

6)pas and waiting for partner to reopen, if he has some playing strength

 

I see only 2 possible choices 6) and 2), my choice is 6)

Bleah. I should overcall in sandwich seat more often. I can't believe that there's 4 auctions for 5-5 or 6 good, and you pass with 5-4 or 6 bad, even with a 17 count. In my very humble opinion, if you're playing a response structure that can't handle most ordinary hands, it's probably time to revise your response structure.

 

I mean, seriously, what % of the time will opener have-

1) over 17 hcp, and/or

2) a GOOD 6 card suit, and/or

3) 5-5 or freakier distribution?

 

Well under half, I would think. And yet, every hand that doesn't fit into one of those three categories passes. Makes it kinda hellish for partner to rebid, don't you think? Do you have a 12 count 3-5-3-2? A 17 count 4-6-2-1 with a bad suit? Or something else? And you'd better be able to pass smoothly, because a slow pass implies more strength.

[brianshark]

To be honest, I don't think my hand is offensively good enough to bid 3♦. I'll pass fairly easily here. I might make a noise if opps bid too high. But other than that, I'm happy defending unless p has something else to say.

[mikeh]

I would pass, and expect to have to find the opening lead.

 

The problem with 3♦ is that partner will usually be endplayed in the bidding.

 

If he has a good hand, in context, he may feel the need to try to reach or to even bid 3N: and my hand rates to be a disappointment in terms of the winners it delivers.

 

If he has a bad hand, and is 2=3 in the reds or 1=3 (which will surprise no-one) he will almost certainly pass. While your 3♦ call does not promise 5, the truth is that you will usually be passing with the average opening hand and 5=4 in the reds. So his percentage call is pass with 2=3: and now we rate to be going doowwwnnnnn!

 

Only if he has a moderate hand with a real fit in ♦s will we be happy with a bid of 3♦ here... [note that if our style is that a 2♥ raise is constructive, then he may have a poor 2♥ raise and now we rate to miss our 6-3 fit, but i don't know if that is our agreement here]

 

The problem with double is that it overstates the hand: when followed by 3♦, it will probably be taken as a much stronger hand, with some ♣ tolerance.

 

The problem with 3♥ is the chance of finding inadequate support.

 

The problem with pass is that it rates to end the auction. But if it doesn't?

 

I am going to be comfortable passing 3♣ (he'll have a decent texture 6+ suit) or bidding 3♦ over double, etc.

 

I am not going to like finding the opening lead, but maybe -110 will be better than anything available our way.

[Apollo81]

I wouldn't pass.

 

Seems like the (my) options are bid 3♦ or try to communicate your 6-4 shape. I would do one or the other depending on who my partner is.

 

If you're sure pard will get "double is takeout" right, then it seems like double followed by 3♦ over pard's 3♣ is probably the best sequence. Even if pard takes this as showing a good hand also, you are sort of close to that.

[pclayton]

I hate it, but here I go - 3♦. Reasons:

 

1. This is a great hand for diamonds. If we catch pard with a fit, 11 tricks are very likely with this great side suit.

 

2. The opponents have a minimum of 8 spades, and could have a lot more. 3♦ should be safe under the assumption of, "If they have a fit, we have a fit".

 

3. Partner may have a slew of clubs, but might not.

 

4. It will be difficult for pard to balance with a little length in their suit.

[karlson]

[hv=n=sxxhqdqjxxxckqjtx&w=s9xxhat9xxdkt98cx&e=skqjtxxhjdc98xxxx&s=saxhkxxxxxdaxxxca]399|300|[/hv]

 

At the table I doubled, planning to bid diamonds over clubs. Only Noble seemed to suggest that this sequence should maybe show an extra heart, as opposed to extra strength. I think partner would probably have taken it as showing a better hand, and I kind of doubt that I have that. I'm not convinced that dbl-3d showing 6-4 is good, either - it seems to suffer more or less the same problems as ELC in other sequences.

 

We didn't play g/b 2N in this auction, sorry if that wasn't clear.

 

The rest of the auction was easy. 3s from lefty, 4N(minors) from partner, 5s from righty, double by me, float. We got it 2 (I thought I screwed up by not leading or switching to a trump, but I guess it turns out I can get endplayed in hearts for -2 anyway.) 5d seems to be -1 on a spade lead.

[Apollo81]

maybe i am putting too much emphasis on communicating my shape...I suppose it is very unlikely that hearts would be better

 

in limited systems this is way easier..dbl then 3♦ describes your strength and shape