pigpenz Posted December 30, 2006 Report Share Posted December 30, 2006 so the does the hanging of Sadaam Hussein change your life? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pbleighton Posted December 30, 2006 Report Share Posted December 30, 2006 No. It also won't do anything significant to the civil war in Iraq. Bush (and the coalition) has hurt that poor country as muchas Hussein. I cry no tears for Hussein, who was an evil butcher, butwill Bush swing for his war crimes? Not likely. Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hrothgar Posted December 30, 2006 Report Share Posted December 30, 2006 Hard to answer: I believe that Sadaam was guilty of some terrible crimes, however, I don't think that he recieved a fair trial. Juan Cole published a good article in Salon this morning documenting a number of issues with the trial. http://www.salon.com/opinion/feature/2006/12/30/saddam/ From my perspective, this was another clear case where the "Means" is a lot more important than the ends. I am philosophically opposed to the death penalty. However, this is one of those cases where I wouldn't have lost all that much sleep about Sadaam's fate. However, the trial was botched so badly that this act isn't going to create any kind of closure. Its simply going pour more gasoline on the fires. Coupled with this, I find it somewhat suspicious that Sadaam was executed before he went on trial for any of his crimes against the Kurds. It was generally presumed that Sadaam's defense would be expose a lot of history that the Bush administration wouldn't want to have see the light of day. Quite frankly, the quick and dirty execution makes it look like he killed to shut him up. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winstonm Posted December 30, 2006 Report Share Posted December 30, 2006 Gee, now I guess we never will find those weapons of mass destruction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
csdenmark Posted December 30, 2006 Report Share Posted December 30, 2006 The good news is that I doubt I will ever have a nightmare that they might have executed an innocent person. Why Hussein if not Pinochet? Pinochet really meant more to me as those crimes were committed in my youth. After this, will it ever be possible to catch Karadzic and Mladic? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
helene_t Posted December 30, 2006 Report Share Posted December 30, 2006 No. It also won't do anything significant to the civil war in Iraq. Agree.Bush (and the coalition) has hurt that poor country as muchas Hussein.Just wonder if "Hussein" is subject or object of the implied sentence. Maybe it doesn't matter ..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sceptic Posted December 30, 2006 Report Share Posted December 30, 2006 yes, I am now going to be more worried about the morons in charge of our countries, They do not have a clue, they are bloody idiots and they would be dangerous if they had half a brain Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1eyedjack Posted December 30, 2006 Report Share Posted December 30, 2006 so the does the hanging of Sadaam Hussein change your life? It sure changed his! (sorry, couldn't think of anything more tasteless to say) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrTodd13 Posted December 30, 2006 Report Share Posted December 30, 2006 Saddam was right about one thing. The result of the "trial" was a foregone conclusion from the very beginning. Having said that, all dictators deserve death and that he was a dictator is not a matter up for question. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pbleighton Posted December 30, 2006 Report Share Posted December 30, 2006 "Just wonder if "Hussein" is subject or object of the implied sentence. Maybe it doesn't matter ..... " Nope. Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barmar Posted December 30, 2006 Report Share Posted December 30, 2006 At least we don't have to worry about Sadaam publishing a book If I Committed Mass Murder, Here's How I'd Do It. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the hog Posted December 31, 2006 Report Share Posted December 31, 2006 Any country which has the death penalty can hardly lay claim to be a civilized country. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike777 Posted December 31, 2006 Report Share Posted December 31, 2006 Any country which has the death penalty can hardly lay claim to be a civilized country. Ok....what do you do with people who kill people in jail? Just wondering. Spend more of your salary/tax money that no one does? Get a second job to pay for better prisons? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sceptic Posted December 31, 2006 Report Share Posted December 31, 2006 Any country which has the death penalty can hardly lay claim to be a civilized country. I would be happy to live in an uncivilised country, I do not believe we should not play god on occasions Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keylime Posted December 31, 2006 Report Share Posted December 31, 2006 It will change my life a little. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1eyedjack Posted December 31, 2006 Report Share Posted December 31, 2006 Any country which has the death penalty can hardly lay claim to be a civilized country. Ok....what do you do with people who kill people in jail? Just wondering. Spend more of your salary/tax money that no one does? Get a second job to pay for better prisons? Pack 'em off to Australia? (Ducks and runs) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hrothgar Posted December 31, 2006 Report Share Posted December 31, 2006 Any country which has the death penalty can hardly lay claim to be a civilized country. Ok....what do you do with people who kill people in jail? Just wondering. Spend more of your salary/tax money that no one does? Get a second job to pay for better prisons? Mike, I've known for a long time that you're a piss poor excuse for a human being, but even I'm surprised by this comment. You don't kill people because you think its convenient... I recall an earlier posting of yours in which you claimed that all taxes were unjustified. You deleted it pretty damn quick, but it was there. At the time, I thought that the posting was pretty telling. I think so even more when I see you make a posting like this. Filthy lucre. Thats all that matters to you, isn't it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike777 Posted December 31, 2006 Report Share Posted December 31, 2006 Richard if you read what I wrote I never used or implied the word convenient. Do you actually know anyone who has been murdered? If you are sure they will not keep killing and killing without the threat of the death penalty ok but please do not put mean words into my mouth. ty.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al_U_Card Posted December 31, 2006 Report Share Posted December 31, 2006 It has saddened me in several ways. To know that we continue to err in the same ways and never learn. To see that we are unable to come up with a "punishment" that would truly serve a purpose......(make S.H. the "Tony Snow" spokesman for the new Kurdish republic. Now that would scare some people for sure...) That our nature is to compare and criticize rather than understand and agree. That in the end, we are all equals and that even if we all face the same eventuality, couldn't it be faced together rather than at each other's throats? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hrothgar Posted December 31, 2006 Report Share Posted December 31, 2006 Do you actually know anyone who has been murdered? I've been lucky enough that none of my friends or family have been a victim of a violent crime. Maybe my opinion about the death penalty would change if someone I knew and loved were raped or murdered. Then again, maybe someone who feels personally victimized shouldn't be in a position to make these types of decisions. Personally, I prefer that these types of issues get decided in a rational and dispassionate manner rather than succumbing to "an eye for an eye" mentality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pclayton Posted December 31, 2006 Report Share Posted December 31, 2006 I'll have to remove him from my Christmas card list. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
helene_t Posted January 1, 2007 Report Share Posted January 1, 2007 Maybe my opinion about the death penalty would change if someone I knew and loved were raped or murdered. Then again, maybe someone who feels personally victimized shouldn't be in a position to make these types of decisions. Excactly. If the purpose of the death penalty is to motivate potential killers not to kill, the question should be:"Do you know someone who was murdered because the killer thought: only 16 (or whatever) years in prison, that's cheap, let me kill someone?" FWIW, I do not have a strong opinion on this subject. I would be strongly against the death penalty, though, if I lived in a country that used lay judges, such as the U.S. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1eyedjack Posted January 1, 2007 Report Share Posted January 1, 2007 There is an eternal conflict within a sentencing structure that attempts both to deter and to punish. If you imposed a million pound/dollar/euro/whatever fine for a parking violation it would, generally, be an effective deterrent. However it would be an excessive punishment for the occasional recipient of a ticket. If you impose the death penalty on a terrorist it would arguably have no deterrent impact whatsoever. It might even have the reverse effect, martyrdom having some attractions to the idealist. On the other hand, depending on your values, it might be regarded as an appropriate punishment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
helene_t Posted January 1, 2007 Report Share Posted January 1, 2007 If you impose the death penalty on a terrorist it would arguably have no deterrent impact whatsoever. It might even have the reverse effect, martyrdom having some attractions to the idealist. On the other hand, depending on your values, it might be regarded as an appropriate punishment. But the psychological explanation for our desire for revanche is the need to deter. So their shouldn't be a conflict between the two. As for you parking violation example: if all violators get caught, the optimal fine is whatever cost the violation imposes on society. This extreme case of a fine is also known as a fee. Suppose the chance of getting caught is 1/10. Then the optimal fine is ten times the cost imposed on society. This may seem unjust for those violators who only commit one such offense in their life and happen to get caught. In the case of crimes that are extremely unlikely to be punished this may be a serious dilemma. I wouldn't be too woried about parking violations, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keylime Posted January 1, 2007 Report Share Posted January 1, 2007 I only have 2 comments: 1. Many forget that this was Iraqi law not our own that was used.2. Richard, why is it that when someone disagrees definitively with your view of the world that they are deemed "less than human"? I can understand the point of not wanting capital punishment but to say someone's pisspoor? Yes I have my view on it but it's mine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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