Usability of the BBO HTML Help

[Kaapo]

Frankly, the usability of the HTML Help web site of BBO is horrible. First of all, it uses the cursed frames. Worst of all, in neither Opera nor Firefox does the back button work. Only way in Opera to browse back is to go to the Contents page via the Contents button. In Firefox, even this isn't possible due to a Javascript error. The fact that pages load a little too slowly doesn't make it any better, either.

 

Since a new BBO interface is about to be launched to the public, a large part of the help needs a rewrite. Hopefully you could put some effort to make the help site follow the HTML and usability/accessibility standards a little better at the same time, too.

[csdenmark]

Frankly, the usability of the HTML Help web site of BBO is horrible. First of all, it uses the cursed frames. Worst of all, in neither Opera nor Firefox does the back button work. Only way in Opera to browse back is to go to the Contents page via the Contents button. In Firefox, even this isn't possible due to a Javascript error. The fact that pages load a little too slowly doesn't make it any better, either.

 

Since a new BBO interface is about to be launched to the public, a large part of the help needs a rewrite. Hopefully you could put some effort to make the help site follow the HTML and usability/accessibility standards a little better at the same time, too.

You have chosen to handicap yourself using browsers not 100% compliant to Microsoft standards. Not fair to blame anybody but yourself.

 

No problems using Internet Explorer, it even looks fit for Internet Explorer 7, which probably means fit for Windows Vista.

 

There are problems in index - but some sites seems to be under construction, even they dont carry a message about that.

[Kaapo]

You have chosen to handicap yourself using browsers not 100% compliant to Microsoft standards. Not fair to blame anybody but yourself.

I don't like bidding restrictions ala the ACBL. In fact, there are no systems restrictions in Finland. Similarly, I don't like someone restricting my choice of web browsers. But I suppose you're happy with using the SAYC bidding system, Claus? :P

 

In fact, I tried the help site using IE but it quite failed to please me even then...

[csdenmark]

You have chosen to handicap yourself using browsers not 100% compliant to Microsoft standards. Not fair to blame anybody but yourself.

I don't like bidding restrictions ala the ACBL. In fact, there are no systems restrictions in Finland. Similarly, I don't like someone restricting my choice of web browsers. But I suppose you're happy with using the SAYC bidding system, Claus? :P

 

In fact, I tried the help site using IE but it quite failed to please me even then...

Your choice of browser has nothing to do with bridge. It is about the ability to read web-sites. You haven chosen Firefox and Opera. As far as I am informed at least Firefox is about Linux programming language and open programming standards. It is a tool connected to AOL. Using such tools you can expect something like 95% compliance to Microsoft standards.

 

Regarding bridge systems: I dont play SAYC and I dont play any standard system at all. I dont play ACBL tournaments and I do not apply to their ruling. I choose myself which rules to apply to.

 

I admire the ACBL approach ruling convention cards mandatory but else I have nothing at all to do with ACBL.

[hrothgar]

Your choice of browser has nothing to do with bridge. It is about the ability to read web-sites. You haven chosen Firefox and Opera. As far as I am informed at least Firefox is about Linux programming language and open programming standards. It is a tool connected to AOL. Using such tools you can expect something like 95% compliance to Microsoft standards.

1. Microsoft ignored Windows Explorer for years. Once Microsoft beat Netscape during the early portions of the browser wars they lost interest in working on improving the browser. Coupled with this, MS helpfully decided to integrate the browser into the Windows OS. Windows Explorer has a bunch of priviledges that should never be granted to an application.

 

The end result of this is that IE was one of the biggest security holes in all of Windows. Nearly everyone that I know who was serious about security moved away from IE as soon as there were good alternatives. (Firefox and Opera are two of the best)

 

Its possible that the new verison of IE solves some of these problems. However, I don't have enough experience with it to be sure.

 

2. Both Netscape and MS had a nasty little history of extending their browsers with a variety of proprietary enhancements. (Microsoft also went the extra mile and modified the OS to deliberate degrade user's experience using third party browsers.) The end results is that there are a number of websites that don't render properly with one browser of the other.

 

Personally, I think that its reasonable that the BBO help system is designed for the lowest common denominator. The BBO help menus are quite simple. They're plain text for the most part. I don't see any reason why they shouldn't work the same with either browser.

[Blofeld]

You have chosen to handicap yourself using browsers not 100% compliant to Microsoft standards. Not fair to blame anybody but yourself.

Oh, that's rich -- implicit assumption that the internet is based on Microsoft standards.

 

I also don't get the bit about "connection with AOL". :P

[Kaapo]

Personally, I think that its reasonable that the BBO help system is designed for the lowest common denominator. The BBO help menus are quite simple. They're plain text for the most part. I don't see any reason why they shouldn't work the same with either browser.

There seems to be different versions of the help. A Google search brings an HTML help site that seems more or less to work in Opera. However, clicking the Help button on the latest BBO beta brought a different help documentation. The latter one seemed somehow to use redirecting to get the contents. Maybe this caused that the back butten didn't work. I haven't got BBO installed on this machine so I cannot give a URL.

[barmar]

You have chosen to handicap yourself using browsers not 100% compliant to Microsoft standards. Not fair to blame anybody but yourself.

When I first read this post, I assumed Claus was being sarcastic, but his subsequent posts make it appear that he's serious. Are you the only one in the world who doesn't know that Microsoft flagrantly ignores many Internet standards -- as the proverbial "500 lb gorilla", they don't feel the need to follow rules set by others. And because many web developers only bother testing their sites with IE, the result is many sites that make use of nonstandard features that only exist in IE, and the sites don't behave properly in any other browser. This is not the fault of the browsers or their users -- open standards exist for a reason, and this is it.

[jikl]

It must be a strange world on Planet Claus.

 

Sean

[csdenmark]

You have chosen to handicap yourself using browsers not 100% compliant to Microsoft standards. Not fair to blame anybody but yourself.

When I first read this post, I assumed Claus was being sarcastic, but his subsequent posts make it appear that he's serious. Are you the only one in the world who doesn't know that Microsoft flagrantly ignores many Internet standards -- as the proverbial "500 lb gorilla", they don't feel the need to follow rules set by others. And because many web developers only bother testing their sites with IE, the result is many sites that make use of nonstandard features that only exist in IE, and the sites don't behave properly in any other browser. This is not the fault of the browsers or their users -- open standards exist for a reason, and this is it.

I am not a programmer and I dont care about that stuff. Now I am pensioner I no longer need to care about software. I try intensive to watch the security topics and market development but not much else. I dont care about Microsoft and I dont like to hate them or to alienate them. I use their standards and we all need to do. Some want to use alternative tools - fine with that - but not all of it fits 100%. As far as I have tested Avant Browser is 100% compatible.

[hrothgar]

I am not a programmer and I dont care about that stuff. Now I am pensioner I no longer need to care about software. I try intensive to watch the security topics and market development but not much else. I dont care about Microsoft and I dont like to hate them or to alienate them. I use their standards and we all need to do.

I remembered when we all decided that we needed to abandon the Internet and migrate over to Microsoft's proprietary MSN (The MICROSOFT NETWORK).

 

For that matter, I remember when we all decided that we needed to start playing Bridge on the Microsoft Game Zone.

 

Microsoft has its good points and its bad points... By and large, I think that the good outweighs the bad. However, the one thing that I'm sure of is that you always need to watch MS carefully and make sure that they aren't able to gain too much power in any given market... If and when they do, their behaviour becomes reprehensible.

 

Open Standards are by far the best way to contain the beast and we all have a vested interest in doing so.

[Kaapo]

Here is a link to the Contents page of the help. It uses Javascript to go to a different location.

 

The page it redirects to has this comment in the Javascript:

/* --- Bug Fix (Back button will fail in Opera) --- */

And also in the same HTML file*:

Your browser does not support frames.

        Ones that do can be downloaded free (Opera is nice).

So it seems quite odd the site doesn't function properly...

 

But, anyway, thanks to the site creator who seems to be John Goold. There are a lot of nice contents (although not what I searched for, but that was quite special). :P

 

*) In the file; not on my screen. I do have frames enabled.

[csdenmark]

Here is a link to the Contents page of the help. It uses Javascript to go to a different location.

 

The page it redirects to has this comment in the Javascript:

/* --- Bug Fix (Back button will fail in Opera) --- */

And also in the same HTML file*:

Your browser does not support frames.

        Ones that do can be downloaded free (Opera is nice).

So it seems quite odd the site doesn't function properly...

 

But, anyway, thanks to the site creator who seems to be John Goold. There are a lot of nice contents (although not what I searched for, but that was quite special). :P

 

*) In the file; not on my screen. I do have frames enabled.

Via your provided link you come to: http://www.bridgebase.com/help/3/common/te...ndex.html?lobby

 

Via BBO platform clicking help you come to: http://www.bridgebase.com/help/1/lobby.html

 

 

It looks like there are at least 2 versions. Maybe that explains the problems.

[csdenmark]

For that matter, I remember when we all decided that we needed to start playing Bridge on the Microsoft Game Zone.

 

Open Standards are by far the best way to contain the beast and we all have a vested interest in doing so.

I remember that too and I still have friends from that time migrated as we to BBO.

 

I got angry with them not because of MSN but simply because they accepted that players like me who prefer strong systems were kicked out. Play SAYC or 2o1 else you are booted on ZONE.

 

The irony of that I think, and often wonder, why 40-50% of the tables plays according to convention card. They really rare need any card at all as they all play just the same.

 

-------------------------------

 

I wonder the point of open standards. Looks mostly like some sort of survival tool for SUN and for poor European communities which need to spare an EURO or better 2.

[pclayton]

2. Both Netscape and MS had a nasty little history of extending their browsers with a variety of proprietary enhancements. (Microsoft also went the extra mile and modified the OS to deliberate degrade user's experience using third party browsers.) The end results is that there are a number of websites that don't render properly with one browser of the other.

 

Personally, I think that its reasonable that the BBO help system is designed for the lowest common denominator. The BBO help menus are quite simple. They're plain text for the most part. I don't see any reason why they shouldn't work the same with either browser.

Is this why Mapquest's maps in Firefox look like jumbled garbage?

 

The next time your computer freezes, time how long it takes for Firefox to shut down compared with IE. Firefox is a breeze; IE is usually open when the system finally takes a dump :P

[Kaapo]

Via your provided link you come to: http://www.bridgebase.com/help/3/common/te...ndex.html?lobby

Via BBO platform clicking help you come to: http://www.bridgebase.com/help/1/lobby.html

In fact, the first one is where I get by clicking on Help in the Lobby of BBO. The first one is a more recent one, too. It covers BBO 4.7.0 (according to a meta tag inside the HTML source). The latter one describes the behaviour of BBO version 3.6.3.

 

Obviously the Help button gets us to different versions of the documentation. I wonder if this is because of different default browsers. Or maybe different BBO versions? I think I'm using the latest beta - at least I downloaded it :rolleyes: - but can't check now really. Opera is one of the 9.x versions

[rona_]

Personally, I think that its reasonable that the BBO help system is designed for the lowest common denominator. The BBO help menus are quite simple. They're plain text for the most part. I don't see any reason why they shouldn't work the same with either browser.

There seems to be different versions of the help. A Google search brings an HTML help site that seems more or less to work in Opera. However, clicking the Help button on the latest BBO beta brought a different help documentation. The latter one seemed somehow to use redirecting to get the contents. Maybe this caused that the back butten didn't work. I haven't got BBO installed on this machine so I cannot give a URL.

I have bbo version 5.0.1. My default browser is firefox. The help button on bbo works well with it and my back and forward buttons work.

 

Rona

[csdenmark]

Via your provided link you come to: http://www.bridgebase.com/help/3/common/te...ndex.html?lobby

Via BBO platform clicking help you come to: http://www.bridgebase.com/help/1/lobby.html

In fact, the first one is where I get by clicking on Help in the Lobby of BBO. The first one is a more recent one, too. It covers BBO 4.7.0 (according to a meta tag inside the HTML source). The latter one describes the behaviour of BBO version 3.6.3.

 

Obviously the Help button gets us to different versions of the documentation. I wonder if this is because of different default browsers. Or maybe different BBO versions? I think I'm using the latest beta - at least I downloaded it ;) - but can't check now really. Opera is one of the 9.x versions

I just read a notice that Firefox now releases an Alpha version of Firefox 3.0.

 

I found a link to a survey for usage of Firefox. This may explain why you use it and I do not. This therefore also explains something about my initial response.

 

http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=36252