Balancing decision

[Guest Jlall]

JT8xxx x 9xx AJx... red/white imps. You pass in first seat and it goes 1C on your left (15+ art), 1D on your right (0-8) you bid 1S, 2H on your left pass pass. What's your action now, and do you agree with your previous bidding?

[mikeh]

I agree with the bidding so far: I hate being red v white with this hand-type, since I so strongly want to bid 2♠ at some point: just not at this point B)

 

I suspect that I will probably have cost my side a trick by my bidding because I am going to get a ♠ lead and that will hurt if partner has Ax or Kx. But that is not enough reason to make another bid, altho 2♠ here should show a bad suit: else I would have opened 2♠.

 

I would expect 2♠ to win more frequently than it loses, but to rarely win big and to occasionally lose huge, so I pass. Besides, I am the wrong side of 50 to bid again here.

[Foxx]

At matchpoints, 2♠ is easy. At IMPs, unfavorable, if the opponents pull the trigger, it will be open season. There will be other hands on which we can try to win an IMP or two.

[the hog]

Pass. I have said it all

[blackshoe]

JT8xxx x 9xx AJx... red/white imps. You pass in first seat and it goes 1C on your left (15+ art), 1D on your right (0-8) you bid 1S, 2H on your left pass pass. What's your action now, and do you agree with your previous bidding?

Pass. I figure I'm lucky LHO didn't bring down the hammer.

 

Re: "red/white". I know this construction is widespread, but it leaves me bemused. I learned it this way:

 

Red: We're vul, they aren't.

Yellow (or amber): both vul.

White: nobody vul.

Green: We're not vul, they're vul.

 

So "red/white" makes no sense to me. ;)

[whereagles]

wierd situation.. pard should have some cards, but he passed 2♥. I guess he's got a heart stack and at most doubleton spade. The hints are all there that pass is the right bid...

[pbleighton]

I understand opening 2S with this hand (I might do it, even at unfavorable), but not passing and later bidding 2S.

 

If I'm going to climb out on a limb, I want to do so before the opps aquire a saw.

 

Peter

[Free]

No I don't agree with previous action: I would've bid 2♠ immediately and let opponents figure out what to do. Now I think I have to pass...

[pclayton]

Wow. I admit a r/w 1♠ overcall wouldn't have occurred to me. I certainly don't want the lead. What does it accomplish, except creating a little 'noise'? I suppose if pard can come up with a 3♠ raise, it might muddy the waters if LHO has a monster. OTOH, if either opponent has 4 spades, its pretty easy for them to saw off 1♠ at these colors. Free's suggestion of 2♠ looks really wild to me.

 

Now that I've survived this, I find myself in the balance chair. Pard heard my vulnerable overcall, and we certainly don't have a 9 card spade fit. Notwithstanding that immediate action over a strong club shows a weaker hand than delayed action that shows strength, pard could have bid something over 2♥. Without discussion, I would think a double of 2♥ by pard is penalty.

 

However, what bothers me most about the hand is the short hearts and 3-3 in the minors. Pard could have a very vanilla 1=3=?=? 13 count and not have a call available over 2♥. Thats another reason not to get involved. If pard was planning some strong 'delayed' action our 1♠ call may have preempted the action too high, and made it appear we have a misfit. I might be putting my neck on the block here, but I'll try to win 6 IMPs with the occasional risk of conceding 14 if its a bloodbath. I think the odds favor bidding and I've talked myself into a balancing double.

[flytoox]

Perhaps the right bid is pass, but i cannot resist to balance with dbl.

[Winstonm]

I join in the chorus - although it feels right to bid again there is a fairly significant chance of a double misfit and the risk of going for a number is too great - if opener can make some kind of noise over 2S then his partner, knowing a strong hand is opposite, can wield the knife with a 5-6 count to any 3-level runout.

 

Too much risk; too little gain.

 

I pass.

 

BTW, I agree with the 1S action due to the nature of the 1C auction as I presume 1S here shows a weaker holding than pass. 9 losers is too much at this vul to jump in with a unilateral 2S so 1S it is - if we can compete and if we do have a plus-score in the offing, it almost has to be in spades. Once a non-good-fit in spades is announced by partner's subsequent pass, I have made my try and can pass without remorse.

[Guest Jlall]

I held this hand and am surprised that I had any support in the way I had bid this hand up until now B) Basically I passed as dealer because thats just how I am... 2S seems suicidal at these colors. Over 1D I still didnt bid 2S because 2S is even more suicidal now, the opps have already passed some information so I have more to lose and less to gain. However I bid 1S not only to preempt LHO from bidding 1H (which to me is great... if you can take 1H away from LHO when you have a stiff you have accomplished a lot, especially against this pair that played a relay system and used 1H over 1D as 20+ and then can relay out full shape etc) but also because this might be our hand! Why shouldn't it be, partners points are behind LHOs, RHOs hand is worse than ours, and we have the highest ranking suit. I would hate to pass throughout when it is our partscore.

 

As for now, I was STILL concerned it was our partscore lol. The opps have stopped in 2H so partner is marked with a pretty decent hand. Yet he didn't bid over 1C, very strange. I figured his heart stack couldn't be that good as he didnt overcall immediately, and he probably had some balanced hand since he hadnt bid yet. If partner has say, a balanced 14 count, 2H and 2S both rate to make. So I chose to bid 2S. Partner was actually 1345 with a bad club suit and 15 highs so he figured he'd get a chance to bid NT or X spades later.

[whereagles]

I held this hand and am surprised that I had any support in the way I had bid this hand up until now :unsure: Basically I passed as dealer because thats just how I am... 2S seems suicidal at these colors. Over 1D I still didnt bid 2S because 2S is even more suicidal now, the opps have already passed some information so I have more to lose and less to gain. However I bid 1S not only to preempt LHO from bidding 1H (which to me is great... if you can take 1H away from LHO when you have a stiff you have accomplished a lot, especially against this pair that played a relay system and used 1H over 1D as 20+ and then can relay out full shape etc) but also because this might be our hand! Why shouldn't it be, partners points are behind LHOs, RHOs hand is worse than ours, and we have the highest ranking suit. I would hate to pass throughout when it is our partscore.

 

As for now, I was STILL concerned it was our partscore lol. The opps have stopped in 2H so partner is marked with a pretty decent hand. Yet he didn't bid over 1C, very strange. I figured his heart stack couldn't be that good as he didnt overcall immediately, and he probably had some balanced hand since he hadnt bid yet. If partner has say, a balanced 14 count, 2H and 2S both rate to make. So I chose to bid 2S. Partner was actually 1345 with a bad club suit and 15 highs so he figured he'd get a chance to bid NT or X spades later.

Agree that 2♠ now is more suicidal than opening it :)

 

Now, that this might be our hand is more debatable. In any case, since pard, which is marked with a good hand and knows our shape, didn't act, he must surely have had a reason not to. Being the weak hand and having shown a great deal of it already, I don't feel there's any need to stretch and take decisions.

 

By the way, it's not strange that pard sits quiet over a strong club with a good hand. That's part of the normal strategy vs precision et al.

[dank]

Pass. You bid 1S, partner took no action, bidding here is terrible and is the kind of thing that ends partnerships.

[Free]

if you can take 1H away from LHO when you have a stiff you have accomplished a lot, especially against this pair that played a relay system and used 1H over 1D as 20+ and then can relay out full shape etc)

A well prepared partnership still has the possibility to figure out a heart fit or if partner is semi positive. I usually play MOSCITO with symmetric relays after 1♣, and if we get an intervention like this, we use pass as extras! Double is a general takeout double with a minimum hand. So bidding 1♠ doesn't take away anything at all. That's why I'd bid 2♠ on the first round, as aggressive as it is, to take some actual space away from them...