Difficult hand

[kenrexford]

Last night, I was dealt ♠ AK10xxx ♥ KJx ♦ A ♣ KJx.

 

I opened 1♠ and heard 1NT. What next?

 

As to system, three possibilities are probable. (A.) Standard, (B.) 2/1 with natural thereafter, and (C.) 2/1 with Bart. I suppose Gazilli and the like are possible.

 

In any event, I dislike 3♠ here because it shuts down hearts. 3♣ has merit. 2♣ risks a pass-out, but that may be right when it happens, and it allows a lot of alternatives, but not sure what next.

 

As it was, partner held ♠ xx ♥ A109xx ♦ xxx ♣ A10x. The field played in 4♠, +680. We found 4♥, which scores +710. I am having difficulty with the auction to slam.

 

After the 3♣ option, partner will bid 3♥, and I suppose 4♦ should be taken as LTTC, and perhaps partner can sniff this...

 

After the 3♠ option, partner might take a stab with 4♣, but that is an ambiguous call at best, and hearts are lost.

 

After the 2♣ option, partner may bid 2♥, but then what???

 

Any suggestions?

[mike777]

This seems like the typical 3Club jump shift hand type in 2/1 into the 3 card suit.

 

After partner's rebid of 3H it seems all roads should lead to slam.

 

At worst opener rebids 4H and responder then moves on with 2 bullets.

 

4D rebid by opener would be a pretty advanced bid for most of us but I could understand just blasting to 6H over 3H, opener does have a great hand.

 

I count this as an adjusted 4.5 loser hand, just short of a strong 2club opener.

[hrothgar]

If you want to be able to bid these types of slams with any degree of accuracy you'll either neither impeccable judgement or a fair amount of science. Personally, i think that its easier to develop your system rather than trying double dummy plausible sequences to 6♥ playing a natural system.

 

If you are going to adopt some science, I think that it makes more sense to use 2♣ as some type of artificial and forcing rebid rather than overloading the 3♣ response.

 

If I were playing with a pickup partner, I'd probably bid 3♣ over 1NT. Its unclear what the best rebid is over 3♣. Personally, I thing that responder's heart suit is somewhat aenemic for a 3♥ rebid and would probably prefer 3♠...

[kenrexford]

I thought the same thing about a 3♣ call. Sure, space exists for a heart rebid, but my KJ in hearts suggested that the 3♠ raise was more likely.

 

In practice, with a newbie partner, I tried an undiscussed 2♣ and heard a 2♥ rebid, which made a 4♥ practical call easy. I risked a bit, with reward. (Standard American was agreed.)

 

The science of a 2♣ semi-forcing call, with whatever extensions are advisable, makes sense with 2/1. With a simple version, partner can bid 2♦ Bart. But, what does one do after a 2♦ Bart call with this hand??? 4♦ has some merits, but we all hate a Splinter with an Ace, especially after this strange auction.

 

3♣ happens to work if partner bids the hearts, but, again, I am not so sure that he will. Bart makes heart introduction much more likely, obviously.

[Finch]

I agree with hrothgar.

 

i) Play a nice simple natural system like Acol. Open an Acol 2S, hear a 3H positive response, and use RKCB to stay out of the grand. Or even if you don't play Acol twos, open 1S and hear a 2H response.

 

ii) If you insist on some sort of artificial NT response to a 1M opening, then play science over it. I play in various regular partnerships, but in all of them I'd start with a totally artificial 2C bid over 1NT.

[kenrexford]

OK. So, it seems that, whatever you play, if partner responds 1NT to a 1♠ opening, 2♣, whatever it means, may be the ideal solution.

 

Now, what next after partner shows hearts (by bidding 2♦ Bart or 2♥ without Bart)???

 

This is where I started thinking. I went with a practical 4♥ because of my partner's inexperience. But, assuming a decent partnership with tools...

[mike777]

First off 2D in Bart does not promise 5 Hearts 100% so you cannot jump to 4H.

 

2D often promises 5H but other hands include invitational hands in either minor, and really good hands with 2 card spade support.

 

This hand type is just your typical 3club jumpshift into a 3 card club suit in 2/1.

[kenrexford]

See -- this is the problem. I happened to have a natural 2♥ call, which made life easier in locating the heart fit. Bart makes it more difficult, as the hand might be minor-oriented.

 

If a slam exists, I am worried about strain. Give partner the A-Q of hearts (and a 5-card or longer suit) without the spade Queen, and 6♥ looks ideal. Add the spade Queen, and I want to protect against a club lead to Declare 6♠. Give partner the club Queen, spade Jack, diamond King, and heart Ace, and 6♠ is superior. Give partner the club Ace, heart Queen, and diamond King, with a small doubleton spade, and 6♥ is superior. 7♥ is a good contract opposite club Ace, heart Ace-Queen, and a doubleton spade; better yet opposite Qx in spades.

 

Slam might also be anti-percentage on some layouts.

 

I can imagine the late part of an auction, where hearts is somehow agreed and partner cues 4♠ with the Queen of spades. Then, RKCB should resolve strain and level, probably.

 

But, how do we get there???

 

If 1♠-P-1NT-P-2♣-P-2♦(Bart)-P-3♠ is forcing, with this type of hand, that answers Q:1. This would make some sense. But, how does partner follow up? 4♠ should probably sign off, inferring a diamond/club hand. 4♥ probably signs off in hearts. What would 4minor be?

 

I can see some logic to this auction, if these meanings are legitimate:

 

...3♠ (forcing, six spades, heart fit (if Responder has hearts)

-P-

4♣ (3NT would sign off, 4♣ flags and agrees hearts with extra's, 4♦ flags and agrees spades, with extras)

-P-

4♦ (LLTC)

-P-

4♠ (spade Queen) OR 4♥ (not spade Queen)

 

This allows Opener to establish the fit and discover the existence or lack thereof of a Queen in spades from Responder, at the cost of describing all minor-suit hands through 3NT.

 

Is this:

 

(A.) weird

(B.) theoretically sound

(C.) plausible after discussion, or

(D.) none of the above???

[whereagles]

Last night, I was dealt ♠ AK10xxx ♥ KJx ♦ A ♣ KJx.

 

I opened 1♠ and heard 1NT. What next?

Are we going through this again? If you..

 

1. are not playing some specialized bid for strong twos (like 2♣ fort indetermined, or 2♦ benjamim)

 

2. refuse to open the hand a strong 2♣

 

3. don't play any artificial bid after 1♠-1NT

 

then you're stuck between 3♣ (distorts shape), 3♠ (distorts strenght) or 3NT (which a random pard will probably take as 19 hcp 5332).

 

By american standards, the most common way out here is 3♣, though I prefer the slight underbid if 3♠ because it's more descriptive.