sceptic Posted August 13, 2006 Report Share Posted August 13, 2006 [hv=d=w&v=a&n=sj7643hk4d9732cq5&w=sat52hj53d86ck984&e=skqht9872dj4cj732&s=s98haq6dakqt5cat6]399|300|Scoring: IMP[/hv] West North East South Pass Pass Pass 1♦ Pass 1♠ Pass 2NT Pass Pass Pass Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P_Marlowe Posted August 13, 2006 Report Share Posted August 13, 2006 You can open 1D or 2NT, assuming 2NT, assuiming2NT shows 20-??, the hand is certaily worth a upgrade. But it should not really matter, since after the 2NT rebid simply bid game (red, IMPs), looking for 5-3 fit in spades however you do it. With kind regardsMarlowe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jillybean Posted August 13, 2006 Report Share Posted August 13, 2006 I'd open 1♦, the hand is not quite good enough for my 2nt opening. After 1♠ I would jump to 3nt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sceptic Posted August 13, 2006 Author Report Share Posted August 13, 2006 ok next question, why 3nt not 2nt as 2NT describes my hand perfectly (if you have chosen not to upgrade to 2NT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jillybean Posted August 13, 2006 Report Share Posted August 13, 2006 I do tend to overbid but on this hand I have 3 Aces, rock solid ♦'s - I only need 1 or 2 tricks from partner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P_Marlowe Posted August 13, 2006 Report Share Posted August 13, 2006 I do tend to overbid but on this hand I have 3 Aces, rock solid ♦'s - I only need 1 or 2 tricks from partner. A 3NT rebid assumes, that partner never responds on sub. min. values. With 1 1/2 tricks partner will raise, he knowswe are red and playing IMP. With kind regardsMarlowe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pbleighton Posted August 13, 2006 Report Share Posted August 13, 2006 jb - why is it first not good enough for a 2NT opening, and then too good for a jump to 2NT? I don't understand. Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Posted August 13, 2006 Report Share Posted August 13, 2006 a 3NT rebid shows a completely different hand, so 1♦ followed by 2NT is perfect. North should just checkback or bid 3NT... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hrothgar Posted August 13, 2006 Report Share Posted August 13, 2006 If a 2NT opening showed 20 HCP, I'd open 2NT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenberg Posted August 13, 2006 Report Share Posted August 13, 2006 I guess I would consider opening 2NT bu I probably wouldn't do it. The hands as they are will make either 3N or 5D, and it is possible, as I contemplate my opening, that partner has a hand such that 5D is the only makeable game. So I open 1D and I think rebidding 2N is then clear. Partner can expect his Q and K to be working and his Jxxxx to be of good use guarding that suit so he could well go on. I wouldn't shoot him if he didn't but I think the responsibility for not reaching 3N lies with him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jillybean Posted August 13, 2006 Report Share Posted August 13, 2006 jb - why is it first not good enough for a 2NT opening, and then too good for a jump to 2NT? I don't understand. PeterSure this is a toss up between 1♣ and 2nt , I would like better ♠ before opening 2nt. After my partner bids 1♠ I'm happy to jump to game. I'd be happy to listen to why I shouldnt jump to game? :) If my partner does not have enough to respond I think I'd rather play this in 1♣ than 2nt. If the opps get into the bidding and partner passes I will have trouble showing my strength and probably have to settle for a lousy 2♣ rebid. jb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pbleighton Posted August 13, 2006 Report Share Posted August 13, 2006 "I'd be happy to listen to why I shouldnt jump to game?" Do your partner's ever respond with 5/bad 6? Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flame Posted August 13, 2006 Report Share Posted August 13, 2006 2NT for me, but dont make the mistake of 1D and then 3NT rebid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jillybean Posted August 13, 2006 Report Share Posted August 13, 2006 "I'd be happy to listen to why I shouldnt jump to game?" Do your partner's ever respond with 5/bad 6? Peter Sure they do. a 3NT rebid shows a completely different hand What does a 3nt rebid show? thanksjb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Posted August 13, 2006 Report Share Posted August 13, 2006 "I'd be happy to listen to why I shouldnt jump to game?" Do your partner's ever respond with 5/bad 6? Peter Sure they do. a 3NT rebid shows a completely different hand What does a 3nt rebid show? thanksjb Slightly less HCP and a solid 6 card m... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flame Posted August 13, 2006 Report Share Posted August 13, 2006 read this one jil http://forums.bridgebase.com/index.php?showtopic=15027 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pbleighton Posted August 13, 2006 Report Share Posted August 13, 2006 "QUOTE (pbleighton @ Aug 13 2006, 08:47 AM) "I'd be happy to listen to why I shouldnt jump to game?" Do your partner's ever respond with 5/bad 6? Peter Sure they do." Then why not let them pass 2NT when they have done so instead of jumping to 3NT? Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pclayton Posted August 13, 2006 Report Share Posted August 13, 2006 I'd open a 20-21 2N. If 2N is 21-22 (stone age), then I'd open it 1♦. A 3N rebid after a 1♦ promises at least another ♦. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jillybean Posted August 13, 2006 Report Share Posted August 13, 2006 thanks great link. Im convinced - next time I will open this 2nt :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeh Posted August 13, 2006 Report Share Posted August 13, 2006 When deciding whether to open this hand 1♦ or 2N, it is important to understand the purpose of counting points. This hand is only 19 hcp, and 2N (for most) requires 20-21. Yet, imho, this is a 2N opener. Points are a guide, an approximation, towards trick-taking ability. While this had has a flaw (the xx in ♠), the AKQ10x holding in ♦ is worth more than '9' points. So if I were trying to fine-tune my valuation in terms of points (an exercise I never indulge in at the table, in that I wouldn't try to estimate a 'point' total for this hand, I would simply know that it was too strong for 1♦ then 2N), I would upgrade this hand to a comfortable 20...I'd downgrade for the ♠ holding, upgrade for the number of controls held and upgrade again for the ♦ suit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenrexford Posted August 13, 2006 Report Share Posted August 13, 2006 IMO, this hand is closer to a 2♣ opening, followed by 2NT (22-24) than a 1♦ opening, followed by a jump to 2NT, especially at IMP's. 2NT as the opening seems right on target, especially if forced to describe this bid as "20-21." If electing to be forced to describe this opening as "21-22," I'd still open 2NT. I am guessing, but I'd venture a small wager that 2NT loses to 5D as the only making game fewer times than we score up +150 or +180 when I open 1♦ and rebid 2NT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricK Posted August 13, 2006 Report Share Posted August 13, 2006 IMO, this hand is closer to a 2♣ opening, followed by 2NT (22-24) than a 1♦ opening, followed by a jump to 2NT, especially at IMP's. 2NT as the opening seems right on target, especially if forced to describe this bid as "20-21." If electing to be forced to describe this opening as "21-22," I'd still open 2NT. I am guessing, but I'd venture a small wager that 2NT loses to 5D as the only making game fewer times than we score up +150 or +180 when I open 1♦ and rebid 2NT. What about the times we get to 6♦ because we opened 1♦? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Posted August 13, 2006 Report Share Posted August 13, 2006 If 2N is 21-22 (stone age) ~snip~ Fantunes play 21-22... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pbleighton Posted August 13, 2006 Report Share Posted August 13, 2006 "Fantunes play 21-22... " And Fantunes play good, old-fashioned sound openers, none of this reckless modern stuff :) Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenrexford Posted August 13, 2006 Report Share Posted August 13, 2006 The likely distributional 6♦ slam would be something like Responder holding x-KJxx-xxxx-Kxxx. Stronger hands will be less a problem if 2NT is opened. With that hand, the alternative auction is 1♦-P-1♥-P-2NT, if somehow the opponents forget about bidding spades. With this auction, we know little more about slam prospects and are probably less likely to sniff a slam than if 2NT is opened. Sure, I picked a specific hand to illustrate the point. But, I would venture that diamonds are not better handled toward slam with the alternative route. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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