How to bid this one

[Miron]

[hv=d=s&v=n&s=sq10xxxhdaj109xxcax]133|100|Scoring: IMP[/hv]

 

Playing precision:

 

1♠ - pass - 3NT - pass

?

3NT is 12-15, balanced with 3♠ support.

 

What will be your bid? You play cuebids, your agreements are rather poor.

 

I bid 4♦:

1♠ - pass - 3NT - pass

4♦ - pass - 4♠ - pass

?

 

What will be your bid?

 

I bid 5♦. Is this reasonable?

 

How would you bid after 1♠ - pass - 3NT?

 

[hv=d=s&v=n&n=saj9hakqxdxxcxxxx&s=sq10xxxhdaj109xxcax]133|200|Scoring: IMP[/hv]

[Blofeld]

I'd prefer to open 1♦.

 

Having opened 1♠, I bid 4♦ over 3NT (this should be a natural second suit rather than a cue) and pass 4♠.

 

I don't like having to bid 3NT with the north hand ; it's not a very good description and it eats a lot of space. Prefer any of 2♣, 2♥ or 2NT (assuming that's a good spade raise) !

 

Having bid 3NT I bid 4♥ over 4♦ ... this is a slam-suitable hand.

[Flame]

I play that you must cue bid your lowest control, 4♦ for me deney ♣ control and there is no way i can convice partner to bid anything then trump if he has no club control. I think most play like that, but i know justin prefer his first cue bids to be natural and therefore would choose 4D rather then 4C too.

[inquiry]

I would open my longer, stronger suit, which in this case is diamonds. I doubt I will get to 6♠, but I would find spades after opener bids and rebids them.

 

Missing this 6♠ is hardly a disaster in the long run. I am not so sure 6♠ is that wonderful of a contract. You have 100% diamond loser, 50% spade loser, and after a club lead, can easily go down two or three (as you can not afford not to take the spade hook for a quick club pitch). You could lose 1♣, 1♠ and 1 or 2♦ (not very likely two diamonds, however). Not that 6♠ is a bad contract. If you can catch the spade king on side to no more than three and hold diamond loser to one, you will make.

[pclayton]

I am blue in the face from talking about this. 5M + 6m - open your 6 card suit first.

[whereagles]

My comments:

 

1♠ 3NT

4♦ 4♠

5♦

 

1♠ = matter of style, but 1♠ sure is playable.

 

3NT = this sort of bid doesn't make much sense playing precision. But ok, it didn't do any harm.

 

4♦ = coming from a limited hand, what else can this be but a shape-showing bid? An 11-15 hand is never strong enough to make slam tries unless it is highly shapely. This is especially true since 3NT was also limited. So 4♦ must logically show at least a very max 55 or a 65 (65 either way). To bid 4♣ here on grounds that controls should be bid up the line is a technical and logical error. Shape comes first, controls come later.

 

4♠ = seeing the wide open clubs and insufficient support for diamonds, this seems a like a sensible action.

 

5♦ = to insist on slam despite pard putting off the brakes requires a freak, so this is definitely some 65 or 75. But since anything you bid automatically shows a 65 or better, why should you insist on diamonds? That would have the tendency to negate club control (an inference that now makes sense, because shape was already shown with 4♦). 5♦ is more like QTxxx -- AKQxxx xx, whereas 5♣ is more like the hand you held, and is thus the correct technical bid. By bidding 5♦ pard fears 2 immediate club losers and must sign-off now.

 

In short, 5♦ is a slightly optimistic (though perfectly reasonable) but a moderate technical mistake. The rest of the bidding seems fine. Not that I'd like to be in 6♠, though :lol:

[luke warm]

I am blue in the face from talking about this. 5M + 6m - open your 6 card suit first.

i agree, *unless* your system is one that allows the *much* better canape openings :) ... i don't like slam here anyway, because i'd know we were missing 3 kings or an ace and a king by the time responder bid 4♠ (outside the heart suit i'd know we had 6 of the 9 controls)

[Free]

I also don't think this is a good slam... :rolleyes:

[foo]

I am blue in the face from talking about this. 5M + 6m - open your 6 card suit first.

What he said. In addition, one of the advantages of playing a FCS vs a "Natural" system is that you can make playing strength or shape based Jump Shifts and Reverses.

 

♠QTxxx♥♦AJT9xx♣Ax

 

This 5 loser hand has enormous playing strength opposite the right Responding hand.

 

Opening 1D instead of 1S w/ this hand has so many advantages I'm surprised anyone wants to open 1S. Especially in the context of a FCS this is not a weak hand.

 

1D-2D! Inverted => slam exploration can begin below 2N...

1D-1H => The warning light is out and whether you decide to rebid 1S or 2S, you at least know what is going on quickly.

1D-1S => Now slam exploration can begin below =1N=...

1D-1N;2S => Now we get to game quickly w/o wasting our time on fruitless slam exploration

1D-2C => The beginnings of a potentially delicate auction to the correct spot.

etc etc.

 

1S-3N;?? Ick. Here we are at the 4 level guessing when we are playing a FCS who's entire point is to =reduce= the frequency with which We guess comapred to those playing "Natural".

 

Open 1D and save yourself some aspirin.

[jdonn]

If you must bid again I would bid 5♣. It will then soon become obvious to you both that you have a second round diamond loser, making slam bad. He might bid 5♥ over that (why didn't he bid 4♥ over 4♦?) and you will both be done.

 

Even if this is how you play the 3NT bid, I hate it with such a concentrated hand.

 

And yes, opening 1♦ would make it much easier to stop at the 4 level.