new mbt

[mpefritz]

Yes, if people want to play at the speed of the slowest player, you can make a tournament where " Every round of action shall continue only after human players finish their bids at all tables. " Maybe..

 

Even if your hand and (partner) GIB's hand are the same at each table..maybe one table declares and the other defends..then info can be passed. Furthermore, auctions at other tables may help you determine partner's HCP so that defending may be easier.

 

The other suggestion is similar S hands all around. Then you must play at same pace, else you might be ahead, know you are going to get a 4 HCP hand, and play slowly to not allow BOTs to have increased chance of a game against you.

 

fritz

[ccccwwww]

play fixed number of boards like 15 or 20

[mpefritz]

Playing a fixed number of boards would give a later player more info. He could know future holdings and change bidding strategy on earlier hands with that knowledge. And if the "barometer" scoring is kept, there would be even more info/advantage to the slower player. (The barometer scoring leads to some interesting strategies as is and I'd hate to see it go)

 

Maybe having a 2 "team" tournament for money bridge where each table gets the same cards and have 3 bots at each table. Cheating would have no benefit since it is player 1 with the cards versus player 2 with the cards. This would be a improvement on the money Bridge games.

[Patapon]

It would be cool if GIB was never the declarer- in MTB's and MB-

[uday]

Cheating would have no benefit since it is player 1 with the cards versus player 2 with the cards.

 

Player1 will dump to player 2 and split the prize

[hotShot]

A way to compenstate the luck factor could be to limit the GIB's score.

 

Lets say the average player makes 12 Boards in 25 minutes. That would be about 6 partscores and 6 gamescores. Half of that would be on the GIB axis.

So the GIBS get the trick score and 3* 50 partcore bonus and 3*game bonus e.g. 300+500+500.

So on average the GIB's get 1450 bonus points and the trick score.

If this was implemented as a bonus limit for the GIB's, the players would have a chance to compensate.

 

Example:

The GIBs start with a grand (7NT) for 1520 (40+6*30 = 220 trick score +1300 bonus points) and follows up with a vul. game (4♠) (4*30=120 trick score + 500 bonus points) this game would only be revarded with a 150 bonus points and for any further conract only the trick score would be assigned.

The player still has some disadvantages, he looses the time the GIBs need to play the board and he has to catch up the lost points.

[Poky]

Cheating would have no benefit since it is player 1 with the cards versus player 2 with the cards.

Player1 will dump to player 2 and split the prize

What do you mean by "dumping"? There is no prize, only total-points worth some ammount of cents.

 

Maybe calling this way of playing "a tournament" is wrong. This is a normal duplicate BFM team game where one player plays agains other in same conditions (and scores are compared in TPs, not in IMPs - to keep the existing format).

[xx1943]

A couple of new ideas:

 

1) Run MBTs where the human (South) is always dealt the "best hand" at the table.

 

2) Run MBTs where the South hand on each board is the same at every table, but the other 3 hands are randomized.

 

What do you think?

 

Fred Gitelman

Bridge Base Inc.

www.bridgebase.com

Hi Fred,

 

1) Congratulations to this great new exciting MBT. Imho this is the best innovation in online bridge for the last years.

 

2) Your questions:

a) Both ideas are great.

B)I like the first more than the second, because human becomes declarer more often and so more challenge and less luck.

 

Many thanks to you and your staff, for providing us players such a great site as BBO.

 

Regards

 

Al

[mpefritz]

If you always have the human with the best hand at the table, you better allow the human to declare when the human side wins the auction. The inferences available knowing you have the "best hand" at the table would be very helpful, and, unless partner GIB was told that info, partner GIB might misdeclare by comparison.

 

fritz

[xx1943]

...

Maybe having a 2 "team" tournament for money bridge where each table gets the same cards and have 3 bots at each table.  Cheating would have no benefit since it is player 1 with the cards versus player 2 with the cards.  This would be a improvement on the money Bridge games.

Great idea

[pigpenz]

It would be cool if GIB was never the declarer- in MTB's and MB-

yes that would make it more likely for the Human Player to control their own destiny.

The commercial version of GIB makes you play the hands when GIB is your partner and supposed to be the delcarer.

[fred]

Most likely we will offer options in this area at some point. There are 4 possibilities:

 

1) declarer always declares

2) human always declares

3) robot always declarers

4) human decides who declares

 

1 is what we have now. I am guessing that you will see 2 and maybe 4 before too long. I doubt there will be much interest in 3 so we probably won't offer this option.

 

Presumably MB table hosts will be able to select one of the options.

 

Presumably we will run at least some MBTs with each of these options. If some options prove more popular we will run more MBTs using those options.

 

Fred Gitelman

Bridge Base Inc.

www.bridgebase.com

[han]

I think that it is certainly in my interest to have the robot declare. I've played in 3 money bridge tournaments now and my record is appalling.

[pigpenz]

I think that it is certainly in my interest to have the robot declare. I've played in 3 money bridge tournaments now and my record is appalling.

welcome to the world of GIB....with the commercial version playing hands from previous blue ribbon pairs i always get my butt kicked.

 

I would like to see all the hand records from a tourney in the free mbt to see what really happens at the other tables??? ;) cause what looks like pretty flat hands somehow someone always seems to crank up a large score, so would like to see what the strategy is :D

[ccccwwww]

I human 7 GIBs play team duplicate, IMP score, the bad side is cost too much resources

[MickyB]

I think that it is certainly in my interest to have the robot declare. I've played in 3 money bridge tournaments now and my record is appalling.

Me too, Han. I've played half a dozen and only finished positive once. Maybe 18 hands in 25 minutes isn't a good idea after all...

[asdfg2k]

I wouldn't beat yourself up too much, as there is a tremendous amount of luck. Theoretically it will even out, but that doesn't provide much immediate gratification when being beaten.

 

I think of it like a matchpoint game. In any given matchpoint event, I usually consider the highest score I'm able to achieve, assuming perfect play, as the score I'm dealt. Sometimes (most of the time?) I boot back a lot of what I'm dealt, but that doesn't change the fact that there is a score I can aspire to, assuming perfect play.

 

The same thing goes in these tournaments. I have played 25 minutes and found myself deep in the hole and others well out of the hole. I think anything less than 10 or so is not a terribly good sampling.

 

Have you played 10?

 

Until you have managed a 1/2 way decent score and approached the 5 minute mark in contention, you are unfamiliar with the best part of these tournaments. The exhiliration is quite remarkable as you are simultaneously bidding and watching the leader board. When the clock does run out and, if you are lucky enough to have beaten the others playing, you find yourself in first place, it is quite a rush.

 

I think these things are destined for great success, no matter how they end up being tweaked by Fred/Uday and Co. They are just a spectacular idea.

[Rain]

Although hands average out after some time, 25 min tourney doesn't allow many hands to be played. However, I prefer the randomness of the tourney. (I mean the luck factor)

 

Even now, I find myself shying away from MBT when fred signs up. Hey its real money! If skill plays a bigger factor, I'm not going to be willing to compete with players I know are a lot better than I am.

[pokerbids]

To be honest I just thought this Money Tourney thing would be just another gizmo and perhaps wasnt for me. Curious fella that I am I decided to try it out just for kicks having already mentally condemed it!!!! Boy was I wrong - It gave me such a rush......I thought I was a fast player did I come down to Earth in a hurry....Besides anything else I tell u one of the unforseen benefits in this is to get the human to improve his speed (at least in my case).

 

As an additional tip set the options to autoplay singletons (one can do with all the help one gets to step up the pace and that helps!!!!)...Am dying to get another crack at it so I will sign off - Ooops one more thing these GIBs are aggressive I sacrificed 4 spades in one hand and without a pause the GIB partner of mine bid 6 spades (I could have throttled it!!!!!!)...Wife did think I had lost my marbles when she heard me cussing at my monitor but then she hasnt had to make a slam with a combined point count of 15!!!!!!

 

cheers poker

[barmar]

I would like to see all the hand records from a tourney in the free mbt to see what really happens at the other tables??? :P cause what looks like pretty flat hands somehow someone always seems to crank up a large score, so would like to see what the strategy is :huh:

MBT is not duplicate bridge, you're not playing the same hands as the other tables. So the concept of "flat hands" doesn't really apply. It's more like rubber bridge -- you win if you get good cards and make the best use of them.

 

If someone at another table makes two slams, they're on their way to winning. And if GIB makes a couple of slams against you, you're probably never going to catch up.

[barmar]

Ooops one more thing these GIBs are aggressive I sacrificed 4 spades in one hand and without a pause the GIB partner of mine bid 6 spades (I could have throttled it!!!!!!)...Wife did think I had lost my marbles when she heard me cussing at my monitor but then she hasnt had to make a slam with a combined point count of 15!!!!!!

yes, they definitely can be aggressive. Here's something that happened to me. GIB opened 1♦ (I don't remember the seat), I bid a major, GIB rebid 2♦, I passed, LHO reopened in the unbid major, and I balanced with 3♣. GIB jumped to 6♣!

 

It turned out not to be a totally ridiculous contract, requiring a trumps to be 3-2 with the Q in the slot. But LHO had Qxx, so it was unmakeable.

 

Oh, and there was also one time when GIB bid a two-card suit twice. I'm not sure what it was thinking that time.

[fred]

Although hands average out after some time, 25 min tourney doesn't allow many hands to be played. However, I prefer the randomness of the tourney. (I mean the luck factor)

 

Even now, I find myself shying away from MBT when fred signs up. Hey its real money! If skill plays a bigger factor, I'm not going to be willing to compete with players I know are a lot better than I am.

If you have seen my scores in recent MBTs you would not be shying away (but shy away from Sheri) :huh:

 

Fred Gitelman

Bridge Base Inc.

www.bridgebase.com

[zenko]

I live in MD so playing for real money is not an option, but I would like to try no-money tourney just for fun. Is there a way to do it?

 

Zenko

[uday]

There is no reason to block the free mbts, I will remove this restriction.

[jocdelevat]

My opinions about mbt:

1.It is great

2.seems to me that the robot plays most of the contracts of our side

3.seems to me the robot do not make finnese when is a must

4.luck is a major factor(sometime i got most of the hands our side won the contract other times I was looking at opss(the 2GIBS) playing.

5.from these options:1) declarer always declares

2) human always declares

3) robot always declarers

4) human decides who declares

 

I choose 4 even I will prefer number 2 (whats the fun to let the robot play?) but time and money push you to be a manager. I prefer to play most of the hands but that wil result in a few boards so I will play just interesting once and let the robot play the boring ones plus all the hands reamaining if time run too fast and i played too slow.