inquiry Posted January 26, 2006 Report Share Posted January 26, 2006 [hv=d=w&v=n&s=sa7hkj9872dca8543]133|100|Scoring: IMPBPO-007BWest North East South(4♠) - 5♦ - (PASS) - ? Can there be a right answer to this tough one?[/hv] This hand is now open for discussion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeartA Posted January 26, 2006 Report Share Posted January 26, 2006 Believe it or not, I chose 6♦, with controls on every side suit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hrothgar Posted January 26, 2006 Report Share Posted January 26, 2006 BPO-007B: 5H This should not be an attempt to rescue partner, but forward going Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dwingo Posted January 26, 2006 Report Share Posted January 26, 2006 BPO-007B: 5H This should not be an attempt to rescue partner, but forward goingWill partner be on the same wavelength? I uttered a small prayer and bid 6♦ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
han Posted January 26, 2006 Report Share Posted January 26, 2006 Wow, 2 out of 3 votes for 6D, amazing! I also bid 5H, but although I agree that this is a constructive bid, I don't think that it necessarily shows a hand as good as this one. If partner really has the hand plus diamond suit that the 6♦ bidders are playing her for then she will likely bid 6♦ herself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Double ! Posted January 26, 2006 Report Share Posted January 26, 2006 thought about doing something other than passing, but chose Pass and hope I get a plus score. I also thought about doing something bad to lho for opening 4S, but decided against it. I hate these type of hands because anything you might do could win. Any further action by me could turn a plus into a minus and vice versa. I am hoping that my controls will cover any losers that P might have. If it makes 6 or 7, well, good 4S bid, opps. Now here is one hand where I wish I had Luis' special sun glasses!!!! DHL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Echognome Posted January 26, 2006 Report Share Posted January 26, 2006 I bid 6♦ too, but I'm having some serious doubts. I'm thinking now of passing and hoping. It's an awkward call regardless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
han Posted January 26, 2006 Report Share Posted January 26, 2006 Now here is one hand where I wish I had Luis' special sun glasses!!!! DHL lol, I agree! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P_Marlowe Posted January 26, 2006 Report Share Posted January 26, 2006 Pass, ... and I was thinking wtp?. Marlowe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finch Posted January 26, 2006 Report Share Posted January 26, 2006 To some extent this is clearly a complete guess. But there's certainly a problem. The following are all perfectly sound 5D overcalls: xxAQxAKQJxxxx Probably 7H. Now take away the DJ and decide where to play... xAxAKQJ10xxxxx 7NT KxxKQJ109xxKQx 5D xxAxxAQJ109xxx- probably prefer to play 5D, but partner will raise 5H. xxAKJ109xxKQxx 6C Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badderzboy Posted January 26, 2006 Report Share Posted January 26, 2006 Oh well, I have a feeling its a Stevie 0 pts here but but I bid 5♠ to suggest a slam somewhere but I must be showing shortage in ♦s here and the other suits...? Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walddk Posted January 26, 2006 Report Share Posted January 26, 2006 To some extent this is clearly a complete guess. But there's certainly a problem. The following are all perfectly sound 5D overcalls: xxAQxAKQJxxxx Probably 7H. Now take away the DJ and decide where to play... xAxAKQJ10xxxxx 7NT KxxKQJ109xxKQx 5D xxAxxAQJ109xxx- probably prefer to play 5D, but partner will raise 5H. xxAKJ109xxKQxx 6C Frances has summed it up; it's a complete guess. 5♦ might be high enough, and on other perfectly normal 5♦ overcalls, we have a small or grand slam. This problem falls into the category of guessing rather than of judgement. Roland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeartA Posted January 26, 2006 Report Share Posted January 26, 2006 Frances has summed it up; it's a complete guess. 5♦ might be high enough, and on other perfectly normal 5♦ overcalls, we have a small or grand slam. This problem falls into the category of guessing rather than of judgement. Roland On average (or probability), 6D is the right choice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr1303 Posted January 26, 2006 Report Share Posted January 26, 2006 6D is good if partner has excellent trumps. However, why should he have a semi-solid 7 card suit for bidding 5D here? He's bidding under pressure, and we should cut him some slack. I chose 5H, which is hopefully at least mildly forward going. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finch Posted January 26, 2006 Report Share Posted January 26, 2006 Frances has summed it up; it's a complete guess. 5♦ might be high enough, and on other perfectly normal 5♦ overcalls, we have a small or grand slam. This problem falls into the category of guessing rather than of judgement. Roland On average (or probability), 6D is the right choice. If you decide not to pass IMO 5♥ is a superior call to 6♦, as long as partner understands what you mean. If it's clear that it means "I have a load of high cards, and I think we should be in slam, but I'm bidding 5H on the off-chance we have a heart fit", then partner can still bid 6D over it, and I don't think you will ever play in 6H when 6D is right, but you will play in hearts sometimes when it's right. So while I agree that the most likely slam is 6D, I don't agree that bidding 6D is the correct call, even given you don't pass. What I would like to bid is 5NT, with the meaning "I want to play a slam somewhere, please suggest a suit" as this brings clubs into the picture. However, I think my partner would interpret 5NT as "grand slam force", in this context meaning "I will play 7D if your suit is really solid, otherwise 6D". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerben42 Posted January 26, 2006 Report Share Posted January 26, 2006 I pass. I expect to lose a ♦ and one other trick. Also it's not clear that we can make a slam in some other denomination. As they say here: "Plusschreiben und gewinnen". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walddk Posted January 26, 2006 Report Share Posted January 26, 2006 What I would like to bid is 5NT, with the meaning "I want to play a slam somewhere, please suggest a suit" as this brings clubs into the picture. However, I think my partner would interpret 5NT as "grand slam force", in this context meaning "I will play 7D if your suit is really solid, otherwise 6D". I agree that 5NT most likely will be interpreted as a grand slam invite for diamonds. If we decide to bid over 5♦, what about 5♠ as a 2-suiter then? That way we get all possible slams into the frame. Just a thought and nothing I have an agreement about at this point. Roland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blofeld Posted January 26, 2006 Report Share Posted January 26, 2006 I bid 5♥, fully understanding that some of the time it will get us too high. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Posted January 26, 2006 Report Share Posted January 26, 2006 I pass, it's a misfit. However we have some very useful values, so it could be wrong... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hrothgar Posted January 26, 2006 Report Share Posted January 26, 2006 I agree that 5NT most likely will be interpreted as a grand slam invite for diamonds. If we decide to bid over 5♦, what about 5♠ as a 2-suiter then? That way we get all possible slams into the frame. Just a thought and nothing I have an agreement about at this point. And now we get to the crux of the matter: In an ideal world we would like to be able to distinquish the following hand types: 1. Hands with Diamond tolerance that want to ask or show controls2. Hands lacking Diamond tolerance that would like to investigate the best level/strain3. Hands with good suits of their own that want investigate controls We have a number of bids available 5♥5♠5N6♣ And need some meta agreement that matches hand types to bids. We also need to worry about bididng space. I suspect that some kind of Lebensohl/Rubensohl type treatment would work well here. We could use 5♥ as a marionette to 5♠ and differentiate between "direct" and "indirect" sequences. Direct sequences (an immediate) 5♠ or 5NT bid would assume Diamonds as trump. Indirect sequences would be directed at exploring other strains. It would be interesting to see if any established pairs use similar methods Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bearmum Posted January 26, 2006 Report Share Posted January 26, 2006 Dealer: West Vul: None Scoring: IMP ♠ A7 ♥ KJ9872 ♦ [space] ♣ A8543 BPO-007BWest North East South(4♠) - 5♦ - (PASS) - ? Can there be a right answer to this tough one? This hand is now open for discussion. I don't think there's a "right" answer as 6 or 7 something COULD be on for us BUT I assume BBO advanced 4♠X is for penalty? (as I can't find anything contracting it ;) ) SO with this hand I would PASS as I would not like to penalise a P who courageously bid a SOLID 7 card (or an 8 card semi-solid) ♦ suit B) If we miss slam -- just say "NICE 4♠ bid opps" and take my lumps :huh: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereagles Posted January 26, 2006 Report Share Posted January 26, 2006 5NT for me, hoping pard will take this as pick-a-slam. Better to play in the right strain, even if at the wrong level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bearmum Posted January 26, 2006 Report Share Posted January 26, 2006 5NT for me, hoping pard will take this as pick-a-slam. Better to play in the right strain, even if at the wrong level.even tho 5♦ MIGHT be the right strain AND right level ??? ;) (JOKE all) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blofeld Posted January 26, 2006 Report Share Posted January 26, 2006 BUT I assume BBO advanced 4♠X is for penalty? (as I can't find anything contracting it ;) ) I was certainly assuming that this double would have been takeout. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finch Posted January 26, 2006 Report Share Posted January 26, 2006 BUT I assume BBO advanced 4♠X is for penalty? (as I can't find anything contracting it ;) ) I was certainly assuming that this double would have been takeout. Is it relevant what double would have been?Once partner has 7+ diamonds, he's not very likely to double whatever he's got, I would have thought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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