kgr Posted January 17, 2006 Report Share Posted January 17, 2006 [hv=d=w&v=n&s=sjxxhxxdtxxxcjxxx]133|100|Scoring: MP[/hv]What do you bid first and 2nd time? (If you pass first time then also give your second choice to be able to give a 2nd bid ;) )(1♦)-DBL-(Pas)-??(Pas)-2♦-(Pas)??(Partner shows 20+ with his DBL + cue) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike777 Posted January 17, 2006 Report Share Posted January 17, 2006 Dealer: West Vul: None Scoring: MP ♠ Jxx ♥ xx ♦ Txxx ♣ Jxxx What do you bid first and 2nd time? (If you pass first time then also give your second choice to be able to give a 2nd bid ;) )(1♦)-DBL-(Pas)-??(Pas)-2♦-(Pas)??(Partner shows 20+ with his DBL + cue) 1) 1s 2) 2s not 3clubs. Partner knows to play me for 2 jacks if he has game in hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al_U_Card Posted January 17, 2006 Report Share Posted January 17, 2006 Looks like pard has a rock crusher and we are the dust.......I like 1S to start and will try 2NT as that ten fourth might be of interest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricK Posted January 17, 2006 Report Share Posted January 17, 2006 First round I bid 2C. Partner has suggested I bid my longest suit and after careful checking I have decided that that is clubs. Second round I bid 2S. Partner has forced me to bid again. My clubs aren't great(!) and spades is my next best suit. By this sequence I have fortuitously managed to inform partner about the location of my hard card strength as well ;) Eric Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jlall Posted January 17, 2006 Report Share Posted January 17, 2006 1) 2C. I bid my longest suit2) 3C. My view is 3C is regressive and everything else shows a little something. I don't have a little something so I can't bid 2S. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inquiry Posted January 17, 2006 Report Share Posted January 17, 2006 first bid 2♣ -- first it is my best suit, second, minor bids tend to slow partner down... spade bids and they envision 4♠ too frequently. second bid, now I bid 2♠. Two ways to look at this, I had spades and choose not show them first time, or I don't have spades and I am broke. I think the second interpretation is correct. This will almost surely be a three card suit and poor hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike777 Posted January 17, 2006 Report Share Posted January 17, 2006 can live with 2c and 3c but strongly disagree with changing suits....after starting with 1s or 2clubs... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jlall Posted January 17, 2006 Report Share Posted January 17, 2006 second bid, now I bid 2♠. Two ways to look at this, I had spades and choose not show them first time, or I don't have spades and I am broke. I think the second interpretation is correct. This will almost surely be a three card suit and poor hand. Why not 3 spades and something decent, like the SA instead of jack? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArcLight Posted January 17, 2006 Report Share Posted January 17, 2006 I bid 1♠ not 2♣. I don't want pard to think I have a long Club suit.Pard should haev at least 3 Spades and possibly 4. I'm forced to bid, if pard bids 2♦ I'll go back to 2 Spades.My hand is so weak it's unlikely pard can get in to take any marked finesses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tysen2k Posted January 17, 2006 Report Share Posted January 17, 2006 2♣ to start. The only time I would pick 1♠ would be if playing ELC and partner would frequently double with short clubs. 2♠ the next time around. Tysen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
han Posted January 17, 2006 Report Share Posted January 17, 2006 Also 2C followed with 3C for me. I also think that 2C followed by 2S shows some values.. more than this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kgr Posted January 17, 2006 Author Report Share Posted January 17, 2006 [hv=n=sakxhakjxdqxcaktx&s=sjxxhxxdtxxxcjxxx]133|200|[/hv]These were both hands. My partner choose to start with 1S and did bid 2H after the cue (to show longer S then H ;) ). I took this as a 5-4 and even with 0 points this could have a play, so I did bid 4H....I prefer 2♣ and 3♣. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Posted January 18, 2006 Report Share Posted January 18, 2006 2♣ and 2♠. Partner knows it's not a 4 card unless my ♣ are a 6 card, so he'll know what to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeh Posted January 18, 2006 Report Share Posted January 18, 2006 2♣ then 3♣ is the clearly correct technical answer, in my view. Put another way: that sequence is easily defensible in any post-mortem. Having said that, I would bid 1♠ then 2♠ many times: partner is far more likely to hold 4♠ than 4♣. Indeed, many players would routinely double with 14 count 4=4=3=2 hands, fearing that pass would block them from the auction. What would I do most often? I cannot answer that question, having peeked at the layout. But the idea of bidding 1♠ then 2♥ leaves me (almost) speechless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pclayton Posted January 18, 2006 Report Share Posted January 18, 2006 1♠ / 2♠. I don't have strong feelings about spades twice or clubs twice, but I have a huge issue with a change of suits or a # of NT. These calls do not convey a bust. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricK Posted January 18, 2006 Report Share Posted January 18, 2006 IMO, when partner A forces partner B to bid, and B makes a non-jump bid, A should never expect B to have something rather than nothing. So all three sequences (2♣ 3♣; 2♣ 2♠ and 2♠ 3♠) promise nothing except length in the suit(s) bid. I am almost certain that if I doubled and then cue-bid on the North hand and partner bid ♠ twice, then I would at least invite the ♠ game (and if I had a working Q instead of ♦Q I would just bid the ♠ game). What else am I supposed to do? Make another nebulous forcing bid and hope that this time partner tells me what suit he really has? I have a lot of respect for the people who are advocating 1♠, 2♠ but on this occasion I don't see the merit to their approach. Eric Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereagles Posted January 18, 2006 Report Share Posted January 18, 2006 There are two ways to bid this hand: 1♠ + 2♠ or 2♣ + 3♣. I'd go for the first option because it allows pard to show his ~21-23 bal hand with 2NT, to which I can pass. On the 2nd option, pard would be forced to shoot at 3NT. However, if you have an agreement that pard's cue is 100% game-forcing, 3NT at the 2nd round is a no-brainer :rolleyes: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fluffy Posted January 18, 2006 Report Share Posted January 18, 2006 I will bid 2♣+3♣, but sincee 2♣ can be strogner than 1♠ on ym style, picking 1♠ has some extra appeal. Probably my partner would bid it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerben42 Posted January 18, 2006 Report Share Posted January 18, 2006 First bid 2♣. Counted my suit lengths twice and still found more ♣ than ♠. Second bid 2♠. I didn't bid them before, which I would have done with 4♠ and 5♣ so can't be that. So 2M here means: Better major and PLEASE stop torturing me. My auction: (1♦) X - 2♣2♦ - 2♠3♣ Pass (3NT surely won't make, 5♣ also needs more than ♣Q only now that partner admits having some ♠) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finch Posted January 18, 2006 Report Share Posted January 18, 2006 First bid 2♣. I agree with the other people who counted their relative suit lengths before deciding what to bid. Second bid. Yuck. Probably 2NT. It's important to agree with partner what bids show extra values after he cues, and what is just shut-up-shop-and-go-home. (I play step 1 over a cue as a negative, everything else showing some values, so would bid 2H but that isn't a standard agreement.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcphee Posted January 18, 2006 Report Share Posted January 18, 2006 One of the theories of the bidding process is, the more you bid the more you have. When partner makes a t/o dble the implication is that have support for the unbid suits. A wlecome idea when you have to respond with bupkiss. The doubling hand now has ways to react to the information he has received. If you double and bid a suit of our own we show a strong hand too good for the simple overcall. If we bid a number of NT we imeeply a hand that was strong than 15-18 which is what the first NT overcall would show. If you cue bid we show a strong hand in support of the responded suit that is TOO good to make a simple raise, the 15-17 range t/o dble. If the responder now bids a new suit they show additional values that are expected to be of use to the hand which doubled. Unless you have an agreement to play lebensohl in response to this cue bid, bidding NT now offers a stop which you do not have. Bidding 2S tells partner you have something of use in this suit. Repeating your suit at a minimum level should warn partner that perhaps they should reconsider before bidding again. Personally this is the sort of message I would like to convey, not being that hopeful any of my J's will provide the fill ins to partners big hand. The last thing I would consider is making any attempt to play some 4-3 S game when I am taking ruffs in the long trump hand. Lasatly if my partner were to bid again after 3C, for example 4C, I would bid game in that strain and expect to make it because now I have the extras he must be searching for, or perhaps he failed to hear that I advertised nothing prior to his raise to 4C. I would not be unhappy if a partner bid 1S in response to the t/o dble. If this was the choice then you must bid 2S after the cue bid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winstonm Posted January 18, 2006 Report Share Posted January 18, 2006 2C the first time.2N the second time - partner has shown a strong hand of unknown type and the best I can do, being required to bid, is show my shape - this is not extra values as with 5-6 and a diamond stop I would have bid 3N - IMO partner has shown his values to be in the 20 or so range, so my bidding at this point should be much like if he opened 2N - I bid the total value of my hand now. 2N would say that this is high enough for me - 3N says we ought to have a play - and 3C says this is enough and I have long clubs. 2H/2S would just show shape. If I really have the 8-9 top end I would bid 3D. Winston Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al_U_Card Posted January 18, 2006 Report Share Posted January 18, 2006 If you respond 1M to a first double and then 2 of a minor to a second double I take that as a poor hand with a longer minor than major (typically 4-5)and a bust because with up to 4-7 hcp I would just repeat the major. Would that idea not apply here? S then C showing a weak hand with longer C? The q-bid just makes his hand stronger, as far as I can see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike777 Posted January 18, 2006 Report Share Posted January 18, 2006 Wow, what a post thread. This thread really surprised me. I must say if we all cannot agree on this one with our expert pick up partner we are going to have problems on most of the rest of our "standard" bidding. <_<. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeartA Posted January 18, 2006 Report Share Posted January 18, 2006 1) 2C. I bid my longest suit2) 3C. My view is 3C is regressive and everything else shows a little something. I don't have a little something so I can't bid 2S. agree with Justin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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