mike_30_london Posted October 13, 2003 Report Share Posted October 13, 2003 Help needed:- I am trying to read up on SPLINTERS and find conflicting information ;). Some info says u can use splinters with 8 card fits, other suggests 9 card fits. Should i start off with 9 card fits and switch to 8 fits when more experienced???? Also can someone read the below and let me know what i think is correct and give me peace of mind!! So far I think I am ok showing splinters as responder (i am using 10-13 pts with singleton and 9-12pts with a void) - Is this correct??? I use strong jump shifts also, not sure if worth mentioning or not, anyway splinters as a responder:- 1h > 3S is splinter 1S > 4H is splinter1d > 3H (i use conv minor so must have at least 5 as p may have 4) Can someone give me some examples of showing a splinter as the opener please with 9 card fits. I have come up with these and wondered if they are ok? 1S, 2H (showing 5), 4d (i have 4 hearts so show diamond splincter - ok?)1D, 2C, 4S (4 card club support, spade splinter - ok???)1C, 1D, 1H, 2d, 4S (diamond support, spade splinter - ok?) Any sensible comments welcome and any links to some good info on splinters is also welcome - Thanks in advance to any who comment ::) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mishovnbg Posted October 13, 2003 Report Share Posted October 13, 2003 Hi Mike! Why we use splinters? Because if in our singleton(S)/void(V) p dont have honours we play now with 30 hcp instead of 40 for 12 tricks ( opps will take only 0/1 trick with their 10 hcp ) and our slam become much more likely. Limits. Splinter consume lot of bidding space and MUST be limited. Original convention ( with limit raises ) show limit raise to level of splinter (game) without counting S/V as source of ruffing tricks ( points for short suit ). This mean opening hand, 12-15hcp with S/10-13 with V. But now are modern preemptive raises and splinters also change to limit raise INCLUDE counting S/V. This mean 10-13hcp with singleton or 8-11hcp with void. Because few hcp they must be controls - A and K. Fit. Normally 4 cards, especially if you count S/V as ruffing value. Original also promisse top honour in fit. Theory also include splinter named "late", which show only 3 fit. Example: 1HE-2CL, 2HE-4DI: "late" splinter, show good CL suit, 3 fit and S/V in DI. Can you make a splinter with 3 fit? Exceptions only establish rules ;). In such case you must not count S/V and therefore must have opening hand, rich of controls include one in trump suit. Example: Axx,x,Axxxx,Axxx. Side suits. Original promisse control in each side suit. Modern bidding dont show such controls in any side suit, but still promisse hand rich of controls. Level of splinter. Splinter above 4 in trump suit show void and is direct RKCB/BW. Your examples: 1DI-2CL, 4SP: RKCB with void in SP and 4+FIT in CL and ofcourse super max. 1CL-1DI, 1HE-2DI, 4SP: RKCB with void in SP and 4+FIT in DI, super max. A can add many similar examples like: 1HE-5CL; 1HE-4SP; 1CL-1SP, 5DI... Misho Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Posted October 13, 2003 Report Share Posted October 13, 2003 Can someone give me some examples of showing a splinter as the opener please with 9 card fits. I have come up with these and wondered if they are ok? 1S, 2H (showing 5), 4d (i have 4 hearts so show diamond splincter - ok?)1D, 2C, 4S (4 card club support, spade splinter - ok???)1C, 1D, 1H, 2d, 4S (diamond support, spade splinter - ok?)These all seem splinters to me, so they're all ok ;) The way I use splinters on an opening is as follows:1M - ? 3C = single or void OM3D = single C3OM = single D4C = void C4D = void D then opener normally shows controls, and after 3C/3D/3OM, 3NT by opener is control in C/D/OM resp., no other biddable control at 3-level. After that we use last train principles... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inquiry Posted October 13, 2003 Report Share Posted October 13, 2003 Help needed:- I am trying to read up on SPLINTERS and find conflicting information :o. This is because so many people bid so differently. You have to fine a philosophy that fits with your theory of the game, as well as within the remainer of your bidding style. Let me suggest one possible site on splinters.. http://www.bridgeguys.com/Conventions/Splinter.html One reason why you seldom see 3 card splitners is that you will then have a side five card suit. Most will bid the five card suit instead of making the splinter (even with four card fit, you often have a side five card suit, I tend to use the splinter only in that situation if the five card suit is weak). So far I think I am ok showing splinters as responder (i am using 10-13 pts with singleton and 9-12pts with a void) - Is this correct??? Don't know, what do you mean by points. High card points or a mix of high card points and distributional points? I go a little weaker than this in high card points, however, the bridgeguy site I listed above uses the same ranges you list in HCP...but again, this is a decision each player has to make on their own. 1h > 3S is splinter 1S > 4H is splinter1d > 3H (i use conv minor so must have at least 5 as p may have 4) 1S, 2H (showing 5), 4d (i have 4 hearts so show diamond splincter - ok?)1D, 2C, 4S (4 card club support, spade splinter - ok???)1C, 1D, 1H, 2d, 4S (diamond support, spade splinter - ok?) All fine splinter bids, but many 2/1-GF players would play 1D-2C; 3S as the splinter bid with a leap to 4S as excusion blackwood. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codo Posted October 13, 2003 Report Share Posted October 13, 2003 Hi all, I disagree with two splinter bids:1D, 2C, 4S (4 card club support, spade splinter - ok???) 1 D 2 C 2 Spade is really strong, so what is 3 Spade then? For me, this is the splinter. 1C, 1D, 1H, 2d, 4S (diamond support, spade splinter - ok?) Same thing. What should 3 Spade be here? I think this should be a splinter too. Kind Regards Roland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keylime Posted October 13, 2003 Report Share Posted October 13, 2003 Splinters, a very popular treatment, but frankly greatly overused. To me, splinters should show a very specific hand type: a hand that has 4 card support and game going values and NOTHING MORE. If you got a hand that can find slam, DO NOT SPLINTER - tells the defense too much information. Furthermore, I rarely use splinters unless I need a certain answer from partner, pretty much only over the forcing club opening - over my limited bids if partner's that good, we'd still be bidding the hand from last week! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the hog Posted October 13, 2003 Report Share Posted October 13, 2003 Interesting last post from Dwayne re misuse of splinters.This hand came up last Wednesday. Partner opens 1S xxxxAKQTxxvoidAKT About half the field splintered on this, which imho is an appalling bid with such a source of tricks in the H suit. Anyone for voidwood? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bglover Posted October 14, 2003 Report Share Posted October 14, 2003 Well... the Hog's point is a good one, but needs illumination given this is the B/I board. Slams usually come about in one of 2 ways... The 1st is where you have a monstrous fit with partner and a lot of high card points on the side. Say partner opens 1s and you are holding something along the lines of: KxxxAQxxAJxkQ Your 19 count and known 9 card fit is highly likely to produce 12 tricks opposite partner's likely minimum 13 count because the rest of your hand is so strong. You would bid 4n asking about controls... if partner has both the AQ of spds and the A of clubs you might even try for 7 (if you are playing that 5n asks for specific kings you may be able to find it), The other common slam comes about where you both have a good suit (not the same suit) and some distributional values that allow you to discard your losers on p's known good suit. For these slams it is most important to know that you DON''T have 2 fast losers in a side suit and that your trump suit doesn't contain a loser. This is the hand that the Hog has given. Altho his example hand contains 4 trumps, it is possible that there are 2 spd losers between the 2 hands. A splinter isn't the best option,,, all this hand cares about is the AKQ of trump. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike_30_london Posted October 14, 2003 Author Report Share Posted October 14, 2003 Firstly I would like to thank everyone for their comments ;D. Regarding the hand as detailed by The_HOG i agree that a splinter bid here would be terrible, i use strong jump shifts so I would jump to 3H after 1S to signal 16+ with a nice suit - eek is this another topic starting!! OK I love bridge and am always trying to find gadgets/methods to improve my game play. Ignoring the defensive play, leads etc are there any gadgets that i could introduce into my game to improve it. Should i forget splinters and go straight to cue bids - I dont even know if u can use both together but my instincts say no? Anyway i use stayman, gerber, transfers weak 2's, ogust, lavinthal discards, learning 0314, step over 2c, Unusual 2NT, michael's, and Neg X. I am also learning cappelletti as 1NT defense. Is there anything that i could learn to significantly improve my game - please please only serious comments - i can imagine the open field on this one ;) Anyway thanks all for your comments Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the hog Posted October 14, 2003 Report Share Posted October 14, 2003 OK I love bridge and am always trying to find gadgets/methods to improve my game play. Ignoring the defensive play, leads etc are there any gadgets that i could introduce into my game to improve it. Should i forget splinters and go straight to cue bids - I dont even know if u can use both together but my instincts say no? Anyway i use stayman, gerber, transfers weak 2's, ogust, lavinthal discards, learning 0314, step over 2c, Unusual 2NT, michael's, and Neg X. I am also learning cappelletti as 1NT defense. Is there anything that i could learn to significantly improve my game - please please only serious comments - i can imagine the open field on this one Mike, I am a gadget freak, but honestly, gadgets, while they can be a lot of fun, will not improve your game. Don't forget about splinters; they are useful when they come up and "yes" you can play splinters and cue bids. The way to distinguish is that a splinter usually occurs immediately after an opening - eg1H 3S or 1S 4C/D. A cue bid usually occurs a bit later in the auction eg 1H 1S2D 3H4C - cue bid with H agreed Some partnerships distinguish between different ranges of splinters 10-12 and 13+. Don't do this yet, there are other more important things to worry about.I would look at major suit raises and continuations thereafter as a good beginning.I would also do a lot of work on the continuations after my 1NT openingeg look at auctions such as 1N 2D2H 3C What do 3D 3H 3S 3N 4C 4D 4H mean in this auction? For which suit, if any, are you showing support? Is responder promising some singleton/ is responder slam going or just looking for the best contract? Which of the following sequences are quantitative and which are Blackwood?1N 2D 1N 4D (Texas transfer to H)2H 4N 4H 4N These are the bread and butter hands of bridge and they come up SO often that if you know what you are doing in these auctions, you will have a huge advantage. Ask casual or even reasonable partnerships how they continue in the above sequences and I bet you will be amazed at what they don't know. Of course the above assumes that you are playing in a regular partnership. There is no point in deciding what bids mean if your partner is tuned in to a totally different wavelength. I would also look at our overcalling structure; are new suits forcing / how do I show strong support / shapely support etc etc. Cheers and good luckRon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inquiry Posted October 15, 2003 Report Share Posted October 15, 2003 OK I love bridge and am always trying to find gadgets/methods to improve my game play. Ignoring the defensive play, leads etc are there any gadgets that i could introduce into my game to improve it. Should i forget splinters and go straight to cue bids - I dont even know if u can use both together but my instincts say no? Anyway i use stayman, gerber, transfers weak 2's, ogust, lavinthal discards, learning 0314, step over 2c, Unusual 2NT, michael's, and Neg X. I am also learning cappelletti as 1NT defense. Is there anything that i could learn to significantly improve my game - please please only serious comments - i can imagine the open field on this one ;) Anyway thanks all for your comments 1) Forget cappelletti and go with DONT or Woosey. 2) Teach yourself fit jumps in competition, and some flavor or weak/preemptive raises with or without competition (a lame way but better than nothing is Bergen). 3) Get a copy of Robson/Segal's book on "partnership bidding at bridge" and read it at least three times. Dan Neill has it in PDF format on his webpage. HEre is a link....http://www.geocities.com/daniel_neill_2000/sys/ look for the line headed "Robson/Segal Notes" Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bearmum Posted October 16, 2003 Report Share Posted October 16, 2003 The way I use splinters on an opening is as follows:1M - ? 3C = single or void OM3D = single C3OM = single D4C = void C4D = void D then opener normally shows controls, and after 3C/3D/3OM, 3NT by opener is control in C/D/OM resp., no other biddable control at 3-level. After that we use last train principles... Well because I am ONLY an intermediate player :)-- I would think 3C 3D are Bergen raises of the major - together with limit raises and jac 2NT EASIER for me to remember :-[ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Posted October 16, 2003 Report Share Posted October 16, 2003 Yeah, but I play majors of 4 cards... So no Bergen for me ;D 2NT is also FG with support (4+), without a single of void. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bearmum Posted October 16, 2003 Report Share Posted October 16, 2003 Yeah, but I play majors of 4 cards... So no Bergen for me ;D 2NT is also FG with support (4+), without a single of void. SP WHY would you SPLINTER playing FOUR card majors - :-[Maybe I am missing something - this IS a beginner /Intermediate string is it not - NOT a REALLY SURER ADVANCED string :'( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Posted October 16, 2003 Report Share Posted October 16, 2003 Hmmm, let me turn that around. Why would I not splinter with 4 card majors??? If you splinter with 5-3 fit, why not with a 4-4 fit? There's no difference, except that 4-4 fit is better than a 5-3 fit imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luke warm Posted October 17, 2003 Report Share Posted October 17, 2003 i'll toss this out because it seems to work.. there's something called the 'rule of 26' that concerns splinters (it's based on at least 4 card support, tho).. it goes like this.. assume 13 points (not hcp only, but playing "points) for the one splintering.. add that to your <HCP> only... if the total you get is 26, slam is more likely than not it actually does seem to work quite well.. taking the hog's example hand, opener would add responder's (supposed) 13 points to his.. if the total is 26+ he'd rkc (or cue, if available).. if opener signs off in game, responder can then do the same.. he can assume 13 points (playing points) and add to <his>.. if total is 26, he's looking sure there are hands that can be constructed where this fails (or where it succeeds), but the same can be said for any 2 hands Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bearmum Posted October 17, 2003 Report Share Posted October 17, 2003 Hmmm, let me turn that around. Why would I not splinter with 4 card majors??? If you splinter with 5-3 fit, why not with a 4-4 fit? There's no difference, except that 4-4 fit is better than a 5-3 fit imo. ACTUALLY I will NOT splinter UNLESS I have four card support for pardsd FIVE card major ::D Did I give the impression that I would splinter wit ONLY a 5/3 fit??? NO WAY :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pbleighton Posted October 17, 2003 Report Share Posted October 17, 2003 "Did I give the impression that I would splinter wit ONLY a 5/3 fit??? NO WAY" Right. The reasons that you should splinter with a 4-4 fit and not a 5-3 fit are:1) Playing 5 card majors, you want to see if there is something better than the 5-3, maybe a 4-4 in the other major, occasionally NT plays better. Playing 4 card majors, when the responder has 4 card support, the search for the trump suit is almost always over.2) 4 trumps with a singleton or void is potentially much more useful than 3 trumps. It may be an extra trick. Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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