Decent 6-4

[Al_U_Card]

Opposite a stiff ♥, despite the 5 loser hand, is it worth that much in 3♥ passed out? If pard prefers back to 2♥ then he has a doub and you are back in business with the 3♥ invite.

 

If pard bids 2NT over 2♥ are you going for the NT game or will you then bid 3♦.......oh wait, I bid 3♥, darn! At least over 2♦ when he bids 2NT you feel a lot better about trying NT.

[pclayton]

I think its real close between 2♦ and 3♥ too. 2♥ doesn't make my list; I'd rather bid 4♥.

 

There's sort of a conundrum here. If pard has a side diamond fit, we want to play 4♥ or SIX ♦'s. As a 3♥ supporter, its exactly the minimum's with a ♦ fit that make 4♥ excellent: xxx, x, AQxx, xxxxx where pard is passing 2♦.

 

However, if I bid 3♥, we can't evaluate through pard's interest if we bid 2♦.

 

I've just chosen 3♥ because its the best value bid. I'm giving up on the magical 6♦.

 

3♥ also has the advantage of making the defense to 4♥ tougher.

 

3♥ - 100

2♦ - 99

4♥ - 50

2♥ - 30

[Kalvan14]

2♦. 2♥ would be an underbid, and 3♥ is not this hand.

[Winstonm]

3H for me - the most practical bid to get to the most likely game.

[jdeegan]

:rolleyes: I was taught by some of Louisiana's best players a few years ago that at IMPs 2♦ is the proper bid with a 6-4 hand that is much better than a min, but not good enough for 3♥. The idea is that you do get to game opposite pard's 9 to 11 count and doubleton heart after he raises diamonds or bids 2 NT.

 

My unenterprising 2♥ rebid cost me a vul game swing in the finals of a state championship team event.

[mike777]

:rolleyes:  I was taught by some of Louisiana's best players a few years ago that at IMPs 2♦ is the proper bid with a 6-4 hand that is much better than a min, but not good enough for 3♥.  The idea is that you do get to game opposite pard's 9 to 11 count and doubleton heart after he raises diamonds or bids 2 NT.

 

My unenterprising 2♥ rebid cost me a vul game swing in the finals of a state championship team event.

as usual if 2h says...14-15 hcp, 3QT and 6 card suit you are fine. 2D can say more. What does 1h say?

[han]

I just noticed this thread and voted for 2D. Not happy about it because those hearts are soooo much better. I've made even worse bids today, but I think that 2♥ is crazy.

[whereagles]

He would rather "die" than bid 2♦ on a hand like this.

Oh, I doubt that :rolleyes:

 

As for what to bid, it's a matter of style and partnership agreement. 2♥, 3♥ and 2♦ are all reasonable and sensible bids.

[jdeegan]

;)  I was taught by some of Louisiana's best players a few years ago that at IMPs 2♦ is the proper bid with a 6-4 hand that is much better than a min, but not good enough for 3♥.  The idea is that you do get to game opposite pard's 9 to 11 count and doubleton heart after he raises diamonds or bids 2 NT.

 

My unenterprising 2♥ rebid cost me a vul game swing in the finals of a state championship team event.

as usual if 2h says...14-15 hcp, 3QT and 6 card suit you are fine. 2D can say more. What does 1h say?

<_< A typical weak hand for the 2♥ bid would range from (10 HCP):

 

xx

KQ10xxx

AJ9

xx

 

up to (13 HCP):

 

Jx

AJ98xx

AQJx

x

 

a three heart bid ought to look like (16 HCP):

 

Kx

AKJ10xx

AJ8x

x

 

the 'in between' 2♦ call is designed to let me bid 4♥ over a 2NT call, 3♥ over a 2♥ preference or a 3♦ raise. Granted, I would like to have stronger diamonds.

 

If partner has a scattered 9-11 HCP, I want to be in game with the given hand (14 HCP) opposite:

 

Kxx

Qx

KJx

J10xxx

 

which is 10 HCP w/o much of a fit.

 

If pard gives me a 2♥ preference, I will raise to 3♥ and play there making three opposite

 

Jxx

xx

KJ10

Qxxxx

 

or be in 4♥ making opposite

 

Axx

xx

KJ10

Qxxxx

 

If you like Mike and Anders' I Fought the Law evaluation, you will correctly deduce that because of its splendid distribution, this hand will make 4♥ opposite 6 HCP IF they are all working (e.g. KJ of diamonds and the heart queen).

 

Given only a choice, I think I would sooner bid 3♥ than 2♥

[mike777]

Jx

AJ98xx

AQJx

x

 

 

Excellent question, pass or 1h or 2h opening bid in first or second seat if playing sound openings?

[mikeh]

Jx

AJ98xx

AQJx

x

 

 

Excellent question, pass or 1h or 2h opening bid in first or second seat if playing sound openings?

Wow!

 

I would consider this to be a solid opener, indeed with modest extras, even if I agreed to play 'sound' opening bids <_<

 

I would think that even Tobias Stone would have opened this 1♥

[Kalvan14]

Jx

AJ98xx

AQJx

x

 

 

Excellent question, pass or 1h or 2h opening bid in first or second seat if playing sound openings?

Wow again.

I'd open 1♥, and rebid 2♦: the concentration is just too nice (btw, you can even keep the J♠)

[black man]

:huh:

After 1 NT forcing, in my opinion, best bid could be 2 diamonds: I have only 14 points, but it seems a good distributional hand, and the possibility of a slam, with only 27/28 points on line is high.

On the 2nd p's bid, I can give the distribution:

- if p gives fi in d or h, i make cuebid in s,

- if p bid 2 NT i bid 3 h, giving a 6 4 distribution;

- if p bid 3 c, 3rd suite, I bid 3 s, ambiguous: 4th suite or cue bid .

sry for my poor english

black man

[mike777]

Jx

AJ98xx

AQJx

x

 

 

Excellent question, pass or 1h or 2h opening bid in first or second seat if playing sound openings?

Ok, I note Al Roth opens 2H.

 

Hope this sidetrack into Roth sound openings generates new discussion, thought and debate on the widely accepted view of lighter openings, random weak 2 bids and the generally accepted thesis of opening first is a big advantage compared to the loss.

 

As a contrarian investment manager my interest rises when almost all the experts and my favorite partner are sold that one style is big loser and not worth considering. I think his exact comment was "can I just slit my throat now"? :P.

 

That may also explain why I was often on the losing end of my law school debates. :P.

 

Thanks for feedback and thoughtful comments from all.