Chamaco Posted December 24, 2005 Report Share Posted December 24, 2005 MP, All vuln. Third seat, you hold AQJAxATxxTxxx You play 13-15 NT (16-18 would be opened 1C and rebid 1NT).This 15 count might perhaps be uipgraded to a 16 count, but nonetheless, after 2 passes, you decide to open 1NT and the bidding proceeds uncontested 1NT-2D(xfer)2H-2S ( natural, invitational, say about 1o good hcp/bad 11 or equivalent playing strength). What now ? You can not rely on any fancy relay, you can just pick the contract. Another important info: you do not play Smolen for 54 hands in the majors: these are just shown via xfers and a natural rebid. I know, the methods might not be optimal (and perhaps Keri or anything else might be better) , but this poll is not about the method, just about evaluating this hand given the few available and inadequate tools :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ardf10987 Posted December 24, 2005 Report Share Posted December 24, 2005 Just because it's Chritsmas... I'll make the rare bid which make my p to play the hand (3♠)... This come closely once a year... ;) Technical matters... who bothers? :P We can wait next year for this... :P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trumpace Posted December 24, 2005 Report Share Posted December 24, 2005 If I could ask for a club stopper by bidding 3C i would bid it. Otherwise 4H seems like an reasonable shot. I don't like 4S. We would probably lose control with repeated club leads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luke warm Posted December 24, 2005 Report Share Posted December 24, 2005 i bid 4♠ because i'm not playing it... well that's only part of the reason, i also think it makes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalvan14 Posted December 25, 2005 Report Share Posted December 25, 2005 Xmas is the season of giving, but greed is in season all the year round. No reasons not to hog this hand too: 3NT, which I rate the most likely contract to succeed. My holdings in the minor suits are good enough, and in any case oppos have still to decide which minor to lead. IMHO, I'd would not be surprised by a spade lead, though. It would be quite a classic, and (in other cases ;) ) pretty effective Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ardf10987 Posted December 25, 2005 Report Share Posted December 25, 2005 What now ? You can not rely on any fancy relay, you can just pick the contract. I told we can wait next years for technical matters... but 3♠ I think it's forcing. May be it's not forcing for everyone, but given the sequence I think it's better if played this way. Or near this way. Over 3♠ p can do a LOT OF INTELLIGENT THINGS... can bid 3NT (5422), can bid 4♥ (6/4), may be he can also bid 4♣ or 4♦ (but these bids are less intelligent for me, w/o agreement). Anyway, this way, last blame will not be mine... ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fluffy Posted December 25, 2005 Report Share Posted December 25, 2005 I think I would just bid 3NT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inquiry Posted December 25, 2005 Report Share Posted December 25, 2005 4♠ under these conditions Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chamaco Posted December 25, 2005 Author Report Share Posted December 25, 2005 What now ? You can not rely on any fancy relay, you can just pick the contract.I told we can wait next years for technical matters... but 3♠ I think it's forcing. May be it's not forcing for everyone, but given the sequence I think it's better if played this way. Responder is a passed hand, and it seems strange to me that a 1NT opener, already limited, can make a forcing raise opposite a passed hand... :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerben42 Posted December 25, 2005 Report Share Posted December 25, 2005 3NT is an option. I'll bid that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ardf10987 Posted December 25, 2005 Report Share Posted December 25, 2005 Chamaco Posted on Dec 24 2005, 10:06 PM What now ? You can not rely on any fancy relay, you can just pick the contract.ardf10987 Posted on Dec 25 2005, 12:28 AM ... but 3♠ I think it's forcing. May be it's not forcing for everyone, but given the sequence I think it's better if played this way. Or near this way. Over 3♠ p can do a LOT OF INTELLIGENT THINGS... Ok..ok...I can't wait till next year... :) Suppose this similar sequence (ops always passing): 1♦ 1♥ 2♦ 2NT... you hold ♠x ♥Qx ♦KQ1098xx ♣KQ10. You would be glad to bid 3♦ not forcing, isn't it? Now suppose the same sequence, having ♠x ♥AQx ♦KQ1098x ♣KQ10 or ♠Axx ♥x ♦KQ1098x ♣AQ10. Now you would be glad to bid 3♥ or 3♦ IF forcing... This problem is just as trying to have two girls: you can't "normally" have both at the same time... :D You must choose... 1 ) If you CAN bid 3♦ NOT FORCING, then you'll have the possibility to play the BEST partial: 2NT or 3♦ or...2 ) If you CAN bid 3♦ FORCING, then you'll have the possibility to play the BEST game: 3NT or 5♦ or...And may be I don't know how to choose in bridge, but I can assure I know how to choose between girls... Anyway, it's difficult to find someone interested in a girl... to play a partial... :P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenberg Posted December 25, 2005 Report Share Posted December 25, 2005 SInce I have a good hand for my bidding and partner is inviting game, I guess I will drive to game. Since any of 3NT, 4S and 4H could be best, why not bid 3D (presumably showing diamond values and asking for guidance). If partner bids 3NT I'll leave it. If he has nothing to offer in clubs I would expect him to rebid whichever major he thinks is the best choice for a 10 tricl contract with seven trumps. I don't see that these methods are particularly inferior, although my judgment might be. Partner has informed you he has 5-4 in the majors and invitational values, you get to show your values and solicit his help in exploring for the best game. IF this is seen as too weak to force a game at matchpoints, and maybe it is, then I think I pass 2S. Being the eternal optimist however, I go for the gold. k Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
temp3600 Posted December 25, 2005 Report Share Posted December 25, 2005 Partner insisted on the majors, and looking at our spade holding he must have good hearts. 4♥.In 4H, I have good hopes of being able to afford to lose the lead once to the opponents and keeping control of the hand. Much less so in 4S or 3NT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pbleighton Posted December 25, 2005 Report Share Posted December 25, 2005 We don't have an eight card fit. 3NT. If I was xxx instead of 10xxx in clubs, I would consider 4H. Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hrothgar Posted December 25, 2005 Report Share Posted December 25, 2005 I'm bidding 3♣, showing a club stop and asking partner if he has a Diamond stopper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jlall Posted December 25, 2005 Report Share Posted December 25, 2005 Pass and hope a plus score is worth some decent matchpoints on this trouble hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pclayton Posted December 25, 2005 Report Share Posted December 25, 2005 I think this is a very tough hand. Somehow passing seems wrong with 11 points in my pard's suits, in spite of the fact that we apprently don't have an 8 card fit (6-2♥'s is still possible though). I'd like to bid a nice forcing 3♦, but thats questionable on whether or not its forcing. I think a 5-2 heart fit rates to play better than the 4-3 spades. We have lots of entries to my hand to ruff whatever minor pard is short in, even if his hearts are weak. At the table, I've already barred pard with my 2 minute hitch, so I think I'd just shoot 4♥. Mauro - whats the actual hand? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenberg Posted December 26, 2005 Report Share Posted December 26, 2005 There is perhaps a question as to whether pard would take 3D as forcing, but I think he should: If I had a hand where I wanted to play 3D opposite a hand with at least 9 cards in the majors and no known cards in diamonds, I would have opened it with 1D.Partner might pass 3D, but I don't think he should. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joker_gib Posted December 26, 2005 Report Share Posted December 26, 2005 No fit, Partner invites and I'm maximum so 3NT, wtp ? Alain Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereagles Posted December 27, 2005 Report Share Posted December 27, 2005 Just bid 3NT. Don't try to get fancy when it's not necessary: with those superb fillings in the majors, you're probably pretty close to 9 tricks on top. Besides, the minor suit holdings, lenght + ace, aren't that bad for 3NT. By the way, I don't think this hand is worth an upgrade to 16 hcp. Too much hcp strenght on short suits and the alternative opening is liable to attract low-level competition. This is a great hand to open 1NT opposite a passed pard. I would probably try 1NT even playing a 12-14 NT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebound Posted December 28, 2005 Report Share Posted December 28, 2005 Just bid 3NT. Don't try to get fancy when it's not necessary: with those superb fillings in the majors, you're probably pretty close to 9 tricks on top. Besides, the minor suit holdings, lenght + ace, aren't that bad for 3NT. By the way, I don't think this hand is worth an upgrade to 16 hcp. Too much hcp strenght on short suits and the alternative opening is liable to attract low-level competition. This is a great hand to open 1NT opposite a passed pard. I would probably try 1NT even playing a 12-14 NT. Ditto. I think Hammonds rule applies. 4♠ might be right but you might end up trying to ruff on the short side. Or 4♥ might be right as long as hearts break. But the 9-trick game seems the best chance to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Posted December 28, 2005 Report Share Posted December 28, 2005 3NT, what's the problem?? :blink: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chamaco Posted December 28, 2005 Author Report Share Posted December 28, 2005 Mauro - whats the actual hand? K10xx - KJxxx - J9x - 9 Pard apologized later for such a light bid, but it's ok, that's not really the point of the post.We have now agreed that an invite opposite this NT range might have such a low hcp content only in case of extra shape (55, 64, etc etc). However, it is interesting to note that even with such low hcp content, 4S is on a 3-3 break (Qx on my right fell on the AK of hearts). IMO, opener's hand is 100% suit oriented, and 3NT rates to play badly (or at any rate, worse than a suit contract) on average, and a simple exercise of trying to construct a possible hand for responder (or, accordingly, a computer simulation)should be enough to verify it. However, I was curious to see how others would evaluate it.Especially, I was wondering whether a 4-3 moysian or a 5-2 heart fit would be more appealing, (if we decide not to play in NT). BTW, I do agree with the fellows who suggested that the 3D bid should be forcing, showing doubt, but at the table I was not sure it would be understood, so I went for 4S. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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