inquiry Posted October 8, 2003 Report Share Posted October 8, 2003 Here is a hand I was kibitzing where henri (ritong) moved to the head of the class with a great pass. EW Vul, IMPS xxx QJxx xxxx xxKQJT xvoid TxxxAQJTx 9xKQTx AJ876x Ritong Axxxx AK98x Kx x North East South WestPASS PASS 1S 2DPass Pass Pass As you can see, EW can make 6C on the diamond hook. If South keeps the bidding open, EW might well bid the vulnerable game or slam. Come on, admit you woud reopen in the south seat. The imp results on the hand were 4DW-2 200 11.075DW-1 100 9.671SS= 80 9.43HS-1 -50 7.333SSx-1 -100 6.473DW+2 -150 5.672DW+4 -170 5.45HSx-3 -500 -0.25CE= -600 -1.735CE+1 -620 -2.133NW+3 -690 -3.43NW+3 -690 -3.45HSx-5 -1100 -9.076HSx-5 -1100 -9.076CE= -1370 -12.136CEx= -1540 -13.87 Of course looking at the trouble EW had finding the slam, the question becomes how should EW bid the slam? If West overcalls (instead of double), it would be easy if EW were playing transfer advances, as EAST could "transfer" to 3C, which of course would get WEST thinking slam immediately. If not playing transfer advances, should West double? Propose your favorite auction for EW. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codo Posted October 8, 2003 Report Share Posted October 8, 2003 Hi Ben, The pass was very successfull, indeed.I still wonder, what had happened, if you change the East and North hand. E/W have no game then, but 4 Heart for N/S has some play (Still hard to make, but could be done).And I doubt, that the bidding had been different. With the given hand, I have no real way to bid it for E/W.Even if I double with the East hand. WHat will I bid after the "sure" bid of 2 Heart from Pd?Or do I lie with a strong NT and play 2 H in a 5-0 fit? So, I surely had needed help from my opponents and had to congratulate henri for his success if he did not cooperate... But maybe next hand he will miss the game, who knows :) Kind Regards Roland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inquiry Posted October 8, 2003 Author Report Share Posted October 8, 2003 It is close, but if you reverse the North and East hand, north with 6-4 hand in the unbid suits might make a slight stretch and make a negative double. Certainly the hand would be distributional enough. As for how to bid the slam EW, I think there is one way, and that way is hinted at in my subject line. Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Posted October 8, 2003 Report Share Posted October 8, 2003 With the given hand, I have no real way to bid it for E/W.Even if I double with the East hand. WHat will I bid after the "sure" bid of 2 Heart from Pd?Or do I lie with a strong NT and play 2 H in a 5-0 fit? I think the 2D bid is VERY bad! You have only 2 losers in your hand. Dbl is another option, and indeed, then you'll most likely get a 2H answer. I suggest to bid 2NT, and cuebid later, but here my partner would definetly bid 5C or even 6C himself, or maybe something else to find slam... Btw, slam depends on DK, so it's 50%. But with the opening you get more chance of winning it. Btw, imo it's allways a bad sign if you need help from opponents to get to the right contract. If you underbid this hand, you have to deal with the possible consequences. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luis Posted October 8, 2003 Report Share Posted October 8, 2003 EW Vul,IMPS xxx QJxx xxxx xxKQJT xvoid TxxxAQJTx 9xKQTx AJ876x Ritong Axxxx AK98x Kx x I really think South pass is wrong, this is not the best pass ever in my opinion it's a lucky pass after one of the worst 2d overcalls ever. West has 21/2 losers tending to be 2 after south opened the bidding. Had west held a normal 2d overcall south pass might have likely produced a bad result for his side. I think west has to bid 2NT and if pd bids something cuebid or do something extra to show his powerful hand. In this particular case over 2NT east can jump to 4c and then west has a very easy 6c bid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irg20 Posted October 8, 2003 Report Share Posted October 8, 2003 2 Diamonds certainly looks a bit on the timid side and south's pass was indeed one of the luckiest you're likely to come across (was 2D in tempo I wonder). For me 2NT guarantees 5-5 in the minors so that would seem to be out (even if it doesn't, I think opposite a red 2NT east has a clear 5C bid as pd not bidding 2NT opposite a passed hand with swill). The problem with 2NT on this hand is that with equal length in both minors pd is quite likely to bid some number of clubs and I might hava a little trouble trying to find out the extent of diamond support that he has. That leaves double for the west hand. The auction is not likely to go out of control at this stage as partner is unlikely to have a string of hearts, being a passed hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luke warm Posted October 8, 2003 Report Share Posted October 8, 2003 seems to me like x then diamonds (unless pard bids clubs) describes a hand this strong, even if pard bids hearts.. most north's i know would bid 2S over x tho, especially at this vulnerability (even this weak), as long as they know their pard's won't get too excited... so what if 1S/x/2S/? ... the danger is east thinking west <must> have at least 4 hearts for the x, which i see happen an awful lot... the east hand is really not that bad after 2S by north, imo, and i think 3C should be the bid.. if north passes, 1S/x/p/ then 2H will be the bid i'm almost certain.. then the club suit might get lost forever, unless west follows thru with 3D forcing.. 2nt could work, as long as east doesn't simply bid 3C, cuz then west might have trouble thinking the fit could be as few as 6, 7 cards.. so if 1S/2nt/p/ i think maybe 5C is the bid.. the moral is, if you're gonna double for takeout, don't be surprised at what partner does all in all, on this hand 2nt works with a pard who bids 5C.. i think x is the best bid, on strength alone, but i don't feel strongly about it.. and the actual 2D i think is about the worst choice Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the hog Posted October 9, 2003 Report Share Posted October 9, 2003 I would not pass the Sth hand. As Luis points out, in a normal auction this can be very wrong. As to how to bid the West hand....? Well, I don't like 2N, though I admit it does work well on this hand. This lays far too much emphasis on the minors when you have 3 stoppers in their suit, and anyway only 9 m suit cards.I would start off with a X and then bid 3D over the probable 2H. On this hand a X should get you to 6C as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mishovnbg Posted October 9, 2003 Report Share Posted October 9, 2003 Hi all! Similar hand already appear at the major world event and the polish expert ( think was Martens) bidded 2NT for nice swing at 6CL! Misho Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
easy Posted October 10, 2003 Report Share Posted October 10, 2003 Assuming that one is playing against reasonable opponents lets ask ourselves (as the south hand) whats going on. Lho has overcalled vulnerable 2 D missing the king. 1. you have 14 hcp and the 2d over call has been passed back to you. Do we think its possible for partner to have a penalty double of 2d? Looking at the KD that is highly unlikely. 2. Partner didnt make a negative double and assuming (1 above) has few hcp. Give pard 4-6 hcp. (with more pard would try to come up with a bid) 3. Missing 26 hcp and pard having at most 6/7 it would seem that rho has somewhere between 6-9 hcp and yet took no call. Sounds like a misfit to me. 4. With 55 in majors need i get involved on this hand? If its a misfit id rather they play the hand. 5. what can we lose by letting them play the hand well not more than 5/6 imps.(assuming part score swing) What do we lose if i reopen with 2H (double makes no sense) If its a misfit we lose 4-6 imps assuming they go down in 2d and we go down in a major) 6. What can we gain...... not much game is unlikely for our side i pass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inquiry Posted October 10, 2003 Author Report Share Posted October 10, 2003 Fred (easy) logic is the same that henri used I am sure. his comment was the possession of the diamond king was the presuading factor. I am curious noone took a good stab at getting to slam EW. I, like so many others, would not overcall 2D with west hand. Nor would I make a double. That is just not going to work out, as you are certain your partner will bid some number of hearts. I believe i will bid 2NT (unusual) in the firm belief that since I hold teh KQJT of their suit, it will not be passed. After partners' expected 3C or 3D, I will trott out a 3S cue-bid. But, if WEST does overcall 2D (and why I mentioned transfer advances), East would like to show his clubs, but a club bid is too encouraging. However, if he is playhing transfer advances, he could use that. What is a transfer advance. After an overcall at the one or two level, all suit bids from the two level cuebid to a single raise are transfers to the next higher suit and show 8+ hcp . A direct raise is weakish, and a transfer raise shows a better hand. So here, after the 2D overcall, EAST can bid 2S to transfer to 3C. Overcaller doesn't have to complete the transfer, and of couse, here he would not. He would become very excited his partner has clubs, and would clearly force to slam after discovering the club ACE. I would suspect that over this transfer advance, a leap to 4H would be exclusion blackwood, and all would be revealed. I am growing very fond of transfer advances after our low level overcalls. Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sartaj1 Posted October 10, 2003 Report Share Posted October 10, 2003 South has opened the bidding. After they overcall,partner has not expressed a desire to compete. The only reason for south to bid again over 2D would be exceptional high card strength, exceptional distribution , or shortage in their suit. South has none of these features. In the context of having already opened a 5 card major, 55 in the majors would hardly qualify as "exceptional distribution". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codo Posted October 10, 2003 Report Share Posted October 10, 2003 I disagree with two points from the guys, who pretend, that you should pas the South hand:2. Partner didnt make a negative double and assuming (1 above) has few hcp. Give pard 4-6 hcp. (with more pard would try to come up with a bidWhy? He can have a hand with more strength but no clear bid:F.e: xx,QJx,xxxx,AKxxSure he can X here but does he really wants to reach 2 Heart in a 4/3 fit and the trump length needed to ruff diamonds?I think to pass such a hand will win more imps in the long run.4. With 55 in majors need i get involved on this hand? If its a misfit id rather they play the hand. But must this be a misfit? This time it was, but I am just sure, that pd has less then 3 spades and no clear bid till now. 6. What can we gain...... not much game is unlikely for our side Why not? As posted before, just change North and west hands and you have a game...Surely it depends on having a fit or not. Without a fit and a passed partner, game chanches are not as big as they could be, but are they really so remote? The only reason for south to bid again over 2D would be exceptional high card strength, exceptional distribution , or shortage in their suit.I have a doubelton in their suit.I have an undiclosed 5 card major with AKxxx.This is nothing exceptional?...wow, where do I have to wait for? 7/6 dstribution? 22 HCPs? Where is the frontier? Kind Regards Roland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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