Three Level Asks and Tells for 3NT

[microcap]

[hv=d=s&v=n&n=s863haj96d843caq3&s=sa5hkda9765ckj764]133|200|Scoring: IMP[/hv]

 

The auction starts normally, I open 1♦, LHO passes, Rex bids 1♥, RHO overcalls 1♠. I rebid 2♣, LHO passes, now Rex jumps to 3♦. Not entirely sure how to take that bid, I bid 3♠ angling for 3NT or even a ♦ slam! Rex comes back with 4♣, now I bid 4♦ which Rex passes!

 

With a rare bit of luck, clubs are 5-0 and I can't get to the board to pitch my ♠ on the A♥, so we end up in the only making contract! LOL But we should be in 3NT.

 

The side issue is how people view showing and asking for stops at the 3 level. Usually Rex and I play the rule of 2 suits open, show stops, one suit open, asks for a stop. But sometimes it gets murky, as in this hand.

 

As always, I look forward to comments. B)

[Guest Jlall]

3S asks for a stop or is an advanced cue. Here I would just bid 3N with your hand since you have a stop (although with Ax often you will try 5 of a minor, your hand is very NTy). I like 4D in this auction to be non forcing, you tried for 3N and have 2 top spade losers so are getting out. If you have a slam try, bid something else.

[cherdano]

The side issue is how people view showing and asking for stops at the 3 level. Usually Rex and I play the rule of 2 suits open, show stops, one suit open, asks for a stop. But sometimes it gets murky, as in this hand.

 

As always, I look forward to comments. B)

Good rule, and it would have worked well with this hand!

You should agree to keep your rule, and discuss whether 4♦ here is forcing (or more generally when you can stop in 4m).

 

Arend

[Finch]

Usually Rex and I play the rule of 2 suits open, show stops, one suit open, asks for a stop.

 

Seems like a good rule, and at least from North's point of view it worked fine on this hand.

 

The difficulty seems to have been not so much what the 3-level cue meant, but how far you were forced. I just about agree with North's interpretation, which seems to have been:

 

- I bid 3D to show an invitational hand with 3-card (possibly 4-card) diamond support.

- My partner bid 3S to see if we had a spade stop

- I bid 4C to say that we didn't, but I had something good in clubs

- Partner gave up on game with 4D

 

Personally, I think I would have played 5D on this hand as I would have bid 3S on the South hand over 3D, not expecting to have 9 tricks if we only had one spade stop. I would have been wrong, and with clubs 5-0 would have lost a game swing. I would be worried about something such as

xxx

AJxx

Kxx

Qxx

 

opposite, now 3NT is hopeless, and 5 of either minor definitely worth being in.

[han]

Agree with Justin.

[Kalvan14]

I think that slam should be out of the discussion (Rex has shown an invitational hand: frankly, in his shoes I would have probably chosen 2♠, instead of 3♦; but it is a matter of style).

3♠ asks for a stopper (this is fair: you might build a lot of hands where 3NT fails, and 5m makes. Since the scoring is IMP, 5m is an acceptable contract. At MP, it would be risky to go beyond 3NT)

Now, Rex denies a stopper (and shows values in ♣). I would simply bid 5♣, completing the picture of my hand and letting Rex decide which m to play.

[EricK]

3S asks for a stop or is an advanced cue. Here I would just bid 3N with your hand since you have a stop (although with Ax often you will try 5 of a minor, your hand is very NTy). I like 4D in this auction to be non forcing, you tried for 3N and have 2 top spade losers so are getting out. If you have a slam try, bid something else.

The dangers of 3NT are when it wrong sides the contract if partner has Qx or Qxx and there are not nine running tricks, or when partner has nothing in spades and we don't have 9 running tricks.

 

The benefit of 3NT is that it will get us to 3NT if there are nine running tricks.

 

Does the benefit outweigh the dangers?

[the hog]

"But we should be in 3NT. "

 

Do you really think so? Should you not be in 5C, or maybe 5D. 3N is an excellent contract AS THE CARDS LIE, but ho can you judge this in the auction with 1 S top only? Realistically, I would prefer to be in 5C.

[Winstonm]

This is simply partnership agreement I would think. Showing stops is helpful on hands such as this where a double stop may be critical - bidding 3N on KQx and 3S on Ax so that partner with Qxx can play the NT. With better diamonds and a better chance of 9 quick tricks I'd just bid 3N - anytime you slow down in this auction there must be doubt over the best contract so it gets a little touchy and I'm not sure when the auction gets gray that this is the right spot for answers in black and white.

 

Winston

[Winstonm]

Agree with Justin.

Wussy!

 

Just because Justin has W.C. behind his name doesn't mean he is ALWAYS right! Get in there and disagree some. ;)

 

Winston

[Robert]

Hello Winston

 

I often post when I disagree with something. Justin happens to be correct about this thread(That means that he agrees with my viewpoint on this thread!) so it is difficult to disagree about post on 'this' thread.

 

World Champions do make mistakes. They do not make nearly as many mistakes as other pairs make, however, they are not by any means perfect.

 

Check some other posts. Justin sometimes gets 'kidded'(I joined in too!) about his 'timid' bidding after Arend(?) made a comment about his bidding 'shyness' was a result of the fact that Justin was 'getting older.'

 

W.C. means that you won a world championship, not that you are never wrong.

 

I have only met a few WC players, I have just so happened to have met many, many more players that have 'never' made 'any' possible mistake. None of the self styled 'perfect players' were world champions. :)

 

I have not seen his picture with the new hair growth(beard?), however, that has already drawn a couple of barbed comments.

 

Sometimes I follow Justins' style and I just forget to shave for a couple of days. It does feel great to shave off the mess after missing a few days.

 

No Wussy here. I call them like I see them.

 

Regards,

Robert

[Winstonm]

Hello Winston

 

I often post when I disagree with something.  Justin happens to be correct about this thread(That means that he agrees with my viewpoint on this thread!) so it is difficult to disagree about post on 'this' thread.

 

World Champions do make mistakes.  They do not make nearly as many mistakes as other pairs make, however, they are not by any means perfect.

 

Check some other posts.  Justin sometimes gets 'kidded'(I joined in too!) about his 'timid' bidding after Arend(?) made a comment about his bidding 'shyness' was a result of the fact that Justin was 'getting older.'

 

W.C. means that you won a world championship, not that you are never wrong.

 

I have only met a few WC players, I have just so happened to have met many, many more players that have 'never' made 'any' possible mistake.  None of the self styled 'perfect players' were world champions.  ;)

 

I have not seen his picture with the new hair growth(beard?), however, that has already drawn a couple of barbed comments.

 

Sometimes I follow Justins' style and I just forget to shave for a couple of days.  It does feel great to shave off the mess after missing a few days.

 

No Wussy here.  I call them like I see them.

 

Regards,

Robert

Way to "Tell it like it is" Robert.