bidable slam?

[dosxtres]

[hv=d=w&v=n&n=sa8765hakj8da4cq6&w=skq102h1063dk92c754&e=sj3h9542dqj8765c10&s=s94hq7d103cakj9832]399|300|Scoring: IMP

SAYC

1S p 2C p

2H p 3NT p

p p

 

Whatever lead: 13 tricks taken[/hv]

 

Is this slam bidable playing sayc or maybe bad bid?

 

Ty

[Gerben42]

Welcome to underbidders anon. ;)

 

First I don't like South's 3NT response, also don't like North's pass of 3NT.

 

I would have bid 3♣ with South, not forcing but if partner can't bid over that it'll be the right thing.

After that I can get to 6 but not to 7 playing SAYC I guess.

[mr1303]

Yeah, 3NT is horrible with 2 low diamonds.

 

Playing SAYC I'm going to punt, since I don't have the science to make this slam good.

 

Something like:

 

1S 2C

2H 3C

3D 4C

6C out

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

 

I am not sure, if the slam can be reached,

but what I am certain about, I would not

loose any sleep about missing this slam,

there is no wastage, every Jack and every

ten is working, if you want to bid such slams,

go artficial, ... hopefully you know how to cope

with interference.

 

- I assume 2C promised a rebid (SAYC ... opener did know this?),

else 2H is an underbid

- 3NT is an overbid, just bid 3C, which shows a 6 card suit

If your partner knows your style, ... you bid his hand for him,

dont be suprised, if you miss slam.

- Playing IMP, opener can bid 4C, whatever this means for you,

since he does not need to worry about 3NT

1) Ace asking => 4S => 6C (opener can count 12 tricks)

2) Natural, slam interes => 5C, denying any side control

=> 6C, the suit needs to be terrific, to justify the 2C bid

 

With kind regards

Marlowe

[Gerben42]

Wouldn't lose sleep about not getting to 7 either, but if 7 is cold I'd like to be in 6 at least!

[kenrexford]

Assuming 1S-P-2C-P-2H makes sense with SAYC, then...

 

3C = six+

3D = Fourth suit, agrees clubs

3H = Heart A/K/Q (one top honor)

3S = Spade control

4C = Two of top three club honors (bypassed 3NT); no diamond control

4H = RKCB for clubs

5C = Two Keys, no club Queen

5H = Kings? (slam try)

7C = Extra length for trick #13

7NT = No sense worrying about voids

[Robert]

hello everyone

 

That jump to 3NT without a diamond stopper was quite a bid.

 

1S-2C-2H-3D* is 4th suit forcing and normally asks partner to bid 3NT with a diamond stopper.

 

The opening bidder is very close to a jump shift to 3H if that is natural. Some play a jump over a 2/1 reply is a shortness showing bid showing club support and heart shortness. Maybe not many play that bid in this section of the forum.

 

A better auction might be 1S-2C-2H-3C-4NT Ace asking would get you to slam.

 

1S-2C-2H-3C-3D does not 'agree' clubs. It is 4th suit forcing asking partner to bid 3NT with a stopper or make another bid to describe his hand.

 

Regards,

Robert

[dosxtres]

First of all, thank all for your comments.

 

I was not worry about arriving to slam, but yes for looking the better way to bid.

I really see now that 3NT was not a good bid, but with the sequence by opener, 1S 2H, by the beggining promising 14-16HCP with at least 5S and 4H, i dont see the better contract to continue.

 

3D to ask for stopper get us out of slam i think. 3C shows long and good club, declarer has no choice but 3NT i think. With club misfit and the majors unsupported, i think we are out of slam again.

 

Who must try to look for slam?

North has the points and controls(and a honor club, i think that is important), south the tricks. I think 3C could be underbid, better 3D to show declarer that with diamond stop i have a helpful suit for NT, 3C with a normal hand in North for a 1S - 2H is not forcing even with diamond stopper when 3NT i think is the correct contract with a lot of tricks in clubs.

 

see what i mean, north hand could be something like

AQJxx KJ10x Kxx xx

The bid could follow the same way

1S p 2C p

2H p ?

 

3D-> let us find a good contract in NT, IMO

3C-> now. is clear for North to bid 3NT or maybe pass?

[beatrix45]

:) I see this hand is an example of why it is better just to bid one's hand rather than masterminding. Responder has a simple 3♣ rebid. Subsequently, the opener can bid 3♦. Responder will squirm and grumble, but will almost have to bid 4♣ w/o three hearts or a diamond card.

 

After that, you ought to get to at least 6♣, either straight away or after another round of cue bidding. Getting to seven with any reasonable confidence of making is probably impossible using SAYC. How can you get the heart queen in the auction?

[kenrexford]

I understand that 3D for most people is a notrump probe. However, this is flawed. Responder could have bid 3D himself to show a diamond stop and long clubs, as diamond natural here would be unnecessary, in my opinion. This enables fourth suit after these auctions to be the fit-showing bid for clubs below 3NT, which solves a world of hurt, this hand being a prime example.

 

So, with the same hand, but a diamond stopper, Responder would have bid 3D. 3C, then, suggests slam interest or a lack of a diamond stopper.

[Finch]

That's not quite true.

3C in SAYC is non-forcing, so responder can't bid 3D (game forcing) rather than 3C if he only has an invite.